I saw an ad for the Crimson Trace laser for the LCP but I can't figure out why I would bother. This little 380 is clearly for close in self defense, and if I need a laser to find the target at 5 or 6 feet, I'm probably too blind to be trusted with a gun in my hand. Is it just for the folks who buy every gadget they can? Or I am missing something meaningful in this new item.
Crimson Trace for LCP" what's the point?
- Thread starter vito
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Cheesewhiz
Hunter
As the neighbor lady across the alley used to say when I asked how she was doing, "don't get me started".
A
Anonymous
IMO most times you will need your gun to defend your life you wont have time to either look for a red laser dot or use the sights, it will be all instinctive point and fire, especially at less than 10 feet with an LCP, so i dont see the point either.
but If youve got the cash.....
now: FLAME AWAY =]
but If youve got the cash.....
now: FLAME AWAY =]
GhosT
Blackhawk
Gonna be the Devils advocate......
Personally, I would be interested, if any member put a CT laser
on their LCP...and fired it at 25 yards....
Would love to see the targets.
My reasoning?
Years ago, I saw a detailed report of Taurus snub nose .38's....
Fired at 100 yards from extremely skilled shooters.......
hitting PIE PLATES on a regular basis.
No way saying a .380 could do the same thing, but proved to me.....
Some small guns can surprise you.....
Ohh and Vito,
I do have Crimson Trace laser's on 2 Ruger handguns....for years now.
Exclude the fact they work well....
The fact is, They can save you the cost of one bullet.
A bright red dot placed on a guy that broke in yer house will get him running........Way better than having to pull the trigger.
Personally, I would be interested, if any member put a CT laser
on their LCP...and fired it at 25 yards....
Would love to see the targets.
My reasoning?
Years ago, I saw a detailed report of Taurus snub nose .38's....
Fired at 100 yards from extremely skilled shooters.......
hitting PIE PLATES on a regular basis.
No way saying a .380 could do the same thing, but proved to me.....
Some small guns can surprise you.....
Ohh and Vito,
I do have Crimson Trace laser's on 2 Ruger handguns....for years now.
Exclude the fact they work well....
The fact is, They can save you the cost of one bullet.
A bright red dot placed on a guy that broke in yer house will get him running........Way better than having to pull the trigger.
wildturk
Single-Sixer
You answered the question in your post. "Point", thats all you need to do with CTC"s. I have a set on my SP and one of my P93's. Put, point the red dot on your target and squeeze the trigger. IMHO that is.
I have ordered a CTC laser for my LCP. The sights on my LCP are hard enough to see in the daytime, let alone at night. It has be an advantage to point the little red dot, knowing the bullet will hit real close to where the dot is sitting, than to just point and shot and hope you get lucky, and don't hit anything you don't want to.
I already have several CTCs, a Lasermax rod laser in my XD 45 and a LaserLyte V2 under my PF 9. The CTCs, IMHO, are the best - no switch to click on (like the rod laser and V2), the natural lay of your finger lights it up..
Hack
I already have several CTCs, a Lasermax rod laser in my XD 45 and a LaserLyte V2 under my PF 9. The CTCs, IMHO, are the best - no switch to click on (like the rod laser and V2), the natural lay of your finger lights it up..
Hack
Bob Munden hit a steel plate at 200 yards with a S&W Model 36, 2" snub nosed .38 Special. Yes, he's a professional shooter. The LCP is capable of very accurate shooting which is severely limited by its necessarily small sights. The Crimson Trace Laser could be a very useful addition in certain situations.
If you've seen the Crimson Trace tv commercials, Todd Jarrett fires a laser equipped handgun from around the right side of an overturned table while looking over the top of the table to identify that his laser was on target.
A concealed carry scenario in a parking lot at night that turns into a shooting would seem to me the perfect example of firing over the hood of a car while using a front wheel/tire for cover. You would be able to possibly see your target from a position not in line with your muzzle.
If you've seen the Crimson Trace tv commercials, Todd Jarrett fires a laser equipped handgun from around the right side of an overturned table while looking over the top of the table to identify that his laser was on target.
A concealed carry scenario in a parking lot at night that turns into a shooting would seem to me the perfect example of firing over the hood of a car while using a front wheel/tire for cover. You would be able to possibly see your target from a position not in line with your muzzle.
dairycreek
Bearcat
I carry the LCP as a backup to my regular CCW. I am also a certified owner of a pair of aging eyes and the Crimson Trace on the little gun gives me a bit of confidence that I can hit something with it. I have been amazed at how much accuracy the CT achieves for me. I put the beam on the target and that's where the bullet hole appears. Gives me a lot of confidence and, at my age, I need all of that I can get.
buckshotshorty
Single-Sixer
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2008
- Messages
- 404
I think the point is that no one knows in which critical situation you may be forced to use a firearm. What if you are 30 feet from a charging, growling pitbull headed straight for your 5 year old daughter, and the only firearm you have is the LCP?
The point is, you just never know, so what's wrong with trying to give yourself the best odds?
The point is, you just never know, so what's wrong with trying to give yourself the best odds?
Jeff Quinn
Single-Sixer
I see the point, and have a CT Laser on my LCP, and on every other handgun that I carry for social purposes. The laser helps me to hit the target with greater precision in low-light conditions. If there was ever a gun that NEEDS a laser, it is the LCP. It is more likely to be in my pocket than a bigger gun when trouble finds me, and there is no way that I can see the sights on an LCP in low light. ESPECIALLY with a small pocket gun, every shot has to count. The CT Laser enables me to place the bullets where needed, and yes, even at 25 yards and beyond, the LCP is a useful defensive tool with the Laser. Without that laser, in dim light, the LCP is a contact weapon, at least for me.
I once thought of handgun laser sights as a gimmick. I was wrong, and am now a believer.
I once thought of handgun laser sights as a gimmick. I was wrong, and am now a believer.
Jeff, I totally agree, and felt like you did, in the past...when I saw that "package" when Frustrated Middle Child was over here with her Dad, Bob C, I was Impressed to say the least and I liked it...some day, when they get ALL the bugs out, I will put one of them all together , just like the picture....... :wink:
Merle1948
Buckeye
In addition to a supplement for my own old eyes, I also see them as useful for someone who doesn't practice a lot.
Think of your wife, or girlfriend, or children.
Do they get in enough practice to be capable in the dark, while terrified?
:shock: :shock: :shock:
Think of your wife, or girlfriend, or children.
Do they get in enough practice to be capable in the dark, while terrified?
:shock: :shock: :shock:
A
Anonymous
Putting a laser on might make things worse. especially for someone who doesnt practice much.
I know if I handed my gf a gun with a laser, in a stressful situation she may pull the gun out and spend her time trying to put the red dot over the bad guy.
it can be hard at times to "SEE" the red dot if you dont see it on your target, and even harder to move that red dot ONTO whatever I want to hit. Which again concerns me that an inexperienced shooter would concentrate too much on where the laser is and not enough on instinctively pointing and shooting.
I tell my gf to point and shoot. At under 15 feet, i dont think she should be doing any different. She hits the target and is certainly much.....much faster than when she tries to use the sights... adding a laser in her situation (and i imagine a great number of inexperienced people) would complicate things for the worse.
I dont know why people think an untrained person, scared for their life, is going to take the time to line up a laser as opposed to lining up some sights.
I practice alot, and running through 90% of situations in my head, cant see myself taking the time to acquire sights, align laser dots or anything else but taking out my gun and instinctively firing.
From http://www.pointshooting.com/ssfails.htm :
"If you have a handgun at home, you probably bought it with the thought in mind that you could use it for self defense. And, you probably have been trained to use the sights for aiming and shooting it.
Well, if you think you will be able to use your handgun and that training in a real self defense situation, you could be dead wrong. And here's why.
Darrell Mulroy, who passed away in 2003, was a LE trainer and an owner of Plus P Technology Inc. in Minneapolis, MN. He stated that he made a review of 900+ videos of real shootings, and found that Sight Shooting was not used in any of them. Here is what he said about Sight Shooting: "You still ASSUME you will look at the gun in a real shooting. Wish we could find it on REAL videos of such things. We are still looking 900+ videos later."
..........
In 1969, the Firearms and Tactics Section of the New York City Police Department instituted a procedure for the in-depth documentation and study of police combat situations. It was designated Department Order SOP 9.
Data gathering began in January 1970, and over 6000 cases were studied during the 1970s. The study results and findings were released in 1981.
The following is from the SOP 9. More info and a link to the SOP 9 data is on the main page.
As to shooting distances:
The shooting distances where officers survived, remained almost the same during the SOP years (1970-1979), and for a random sampling of cases going back as far as 1929. 4,000 cases were reviewed. The shooting distance in 75% of those cases was less than 20 feet.
Contact to 10 feet ... 51%
10 feet to 20 feet .... 24%
As to sight alignment:
In 70% of the cases reviewed, sight alignment was not used. Officers reported that they used instinctive or point shooting.
As the distance between the officer and his opponent increased, some type of aiming was reported in 20% of the cases. This aiming or sighting ran from using the barrel as an aiming reference to picking up the front sight and utilizing fine sight alignment.
The remaining 10% could not remember whether they had aimed or pointed and fired the weapon instinctively. "
I know if I handed my gf a gun with a laser, in a stressful situation she may pull the gun out and spend her time trying to put the red dot over the bad guy.
it can be hard at times to "SEE" the red dot if you dont see it on your target, and even harder to move that red dot ONTO whatever I want to hit. Which again concerns me that an inexperienced shooter would concentrate too much on where the laser is and not enough on instinctively pointing and shooting.
I tell my gf to point and shoot. At under 15 feet, i dont think she should be doing any different. She hits the target and is certainly much.....much faster than when she tries to use the sights... adding a laser in her situation (and i imagine a great number of inexperienced people) would complicate things for the worse.
I dont know why people think an untrained person, scared for their life, is going to take the time to line up a laser as opposed to lining up some sights.
I practice alot, and running through 90% of situations in my head, cant see myself taking the time to acquire sights, align laser dots or anything else but taking out my gun and instinctively firing.
From http://www.pointshooting.com/ssfails.htm :
"If you have a handgun at home, you probably bought it with the thought in mind that you could use it for self defense. And, you probably have been trained to use the sights for aiming and shooting it.
Well, if you think you will be able to use your handgun and that training in a real self defense situation, you could be dead wrong. And here's why.
Darrell Mulroy, who passed away in 2003, was a LE trainer and an owner of Plus P Technology Inc. in Minneapolis, MN. He stated that he made a review of 900+ videos of real shootings, and found that Sight Shooting was not used in any of them. Here is what he said about Sight Shooting: "You still ASSUME you will look at the gun in a real shooting. Wish we could find it on REAL videos of such things. We are still looking 900+ videos later."
..........
In 1969, the Firearms and Tactics Section of the New York City Police Department instituted a procedure for the in-depth documentation and study of police combat situations. It was designated Department Order SOP 9.
Data gathering began in January 1970, and over 6000 cases were studied during the 1970s. The study results and findings were released in 1981.
The following is from the SOP 9. More info and a link to the SOP 9 data is on the main page.
As to shooting distances:
The shooting distances where officers survived, remained almost the same during the SOP years (1970-1979), and for a random sampling of cases going back as far as 1929. 4,000 cases were reviewed. The shooting distance in 75% of those cases was less than 20 feet.
Contact to 10 feet ... 51%
10 feet to 20 feet .... 24%
As to sight alignment:
In 70% of the cases reviewed, sight alignment was not used. Officers reported that they used instinctive or point shooting.
As the distance between the officer and his opponent increased, some type of aiming was reported in 20% of the cases. This aiming or sighting ran from using the barrel as an aiming reference to picking up the front sight and utilizing fine sight alignment.
The remaining 10% could not remember whether they had aimed or pointed and fired the weapon instinctively. "
rugerguy":2zk6uws4 said:
+1
Took my LCP to the range today. 3 clips later from 15 feet. All within a 4 inch circle of center of mass. Others probably shoot better than I do but the CT gives me confidence that I can protect myself reasonably well with the LCP. I was never that accurate before I added the CT. For an old guy with not so great eyesight, the CT helps.
A
Anonymous
GunCSI":1b33wrh2 said:
:lol:
wildturk
Single-Sixer
GunCSI":18a4guoc said:
I'd do a little more research on Laser use before making that comment.... Just wondering if you "have" actually tried CTC grips or a rail mounted Laser, Light/ Laser combo Tac light.
