Chingachgook

[Sharps40]

Chingachgook.....Last of the Mohicans.

1893 Marlin. Smokeless steel barrel. 3030. Reblued. Rifle butt, steel. Wood refinished. Good + bore. Tight as nearly new.

Issues.

Replacement Rocky Mountain Front sight. This would NOT have been the original front sight as the gun was factory equipped with the LL Hepburn receiver sight. Though initially installed backwards and now on correctly, it is to low for a receiver sight in any event....it would be correct for a rifle issued with barrel rear sight only. Correct blade with the Hepburn would likely have been a lyman/marbles style in much taller size, probably about .5 or so tall....this blade is about .340 for rear barrel sight only. So.....the front sight will be replaced, hopefully with something classy and of a compromise size to work with barrel and receiver sight.

A blank was replaced with a marlin folding rear and will be replaced again, with luck, a period style barrel rear sight that folds, does not mark the reblued and serves as a second sighting system and a snap shooting system for close/running shooting and for when the twilight or canopy make the peep useless in the woods. i.e. a fast handling point blank to 50-100 yard sight.

The LL Hepburn receiver sight is long gone and $250+ to replace it. The holes in the bridge are factory for the Hepburn sight. There will be no more holes drilled in the gun....no matter what. While the attached peep is well made and looks nice, it is a moderately expensive means to hamstring the utility of a fine fast handling rifle. It leaves absolutely zero windage capability out back. It does not allow for rapid removal and reinstallation to use the barrel sight. It provides only the coarsest of elevation adjustments, on the order of 2" to 3" of movement at 100 yards for each half turn of the stem. And finally, it requires a taller front sight anyway, on the order of .6-.7". If we need a front sight that high, it better be good looking.



The "receiver sight" currently on the gun, less than desirable when considering functionality.

For LESS money and free shipping (use yer google foo), than the attached peep cost, a fully functional sight from a company that made receiver sights way back when was located. In addition, for a touch more, a front sight blank, already well cut out was rounded up. Barrel sight is on the way. We'll see if it'll all work later after measurements are made and calculations completed.

Oh yeah, when selecting one of these receiver sights it is NOT necessary to select one for an 1893 marlin. Since we'll not be drilling holes, any flat side sight of suitable old style construction that provides full function will be fine. Shop by period, price, alloy or steel, but shop and select a sight that complements the rifle and its uses instead of "cutting off" one or more of its legs.

Shown below is a Lyman 66U for fat body Shotguns. But it was selected for two reasons, it cost less shipped (new in box) than the handicapping receiver sight shown above and with its "Shotgun" design, it has a thin body, which effectively produces a "longer" cross arm on the skinny bridge of the Marlin (as compaied to the fat bridge of a pump shotgun) A sturdy steel mount will be made up, using the factory Hepburn sight mounting holes and the cross arm will then center as if its skinny side was made for the marlin instead of the fat shotgun.

This period style sight can be zeroed for favorite load, adjusted in a flash to any longer ranges and completely installed and removed in seconds as dictated by the hunter and the situation.....versatile.

Lots of words right above there....it'll make sense as we go.....probably spilling the beans to early. But, in the end, I hope to have two period style sighting systems, bot providing full windage and elevation adjustments to maximize what is a rifle deserving of maximization.

 

[Sharps40]

In order to get to the point of calculating front sight height (and subsequently determining if a mid barrel sight of sufficient height can be located for dual sighting capability) the receiver sight has to be installed first. From which measurements will be made and all calculations commenced. All other sighting planes will derive from the receiver sight.

An initial template is made up on the rifle.

Template transferred to paper.

So.....a piece of 90 degree bend steel. Tow hitch plate. Strong enough and way over thickness......enough for towing 3500 lbs and more than enough to provide a solid receiver sight mount.

Transfer the template to the INSIDE of the bend.....so it won't cut out too small.

Rough sawn and roughly positioned on the receiver bridge.

Placement of the sight, roughly, behind and below the receiver sight mount. This position adequately clears the hammer and in the end, hopefully allow for both depression of the sight to nearly touch the receiver (while still being able to see over the mount) and elevation well above it. A proper receiver sight can allow for ranges of 400 yards. Far beyond humane use of a 3030 or accurate fire for that matter, but its always a hoot to pop water filled jugs at those distances.

 

[Enigma]

I can't wait to see the completed sight installation. I really enjoy pictures of your work, and on a classic like this old Marlin, it will be even better!

 

[Sharps40]

Almost time to go check the brown on Busby and then go hunting but......80% level. Durn fine. Mounting the sight block and then final sculpting and rust bluing is all that remains for the new receiver sight.

All you youngins with guns, leggo the spray paint and get busy carvin steel, its more rewarding and lasts longer than paint.

The adapter....free. The weaver head screws, from an old old marlin no less, free.

The sight, taped on, to get an ider how it may soon be sitting. $32 delivered, new in box (regularly $99 to $150).

First look, the view to a kilt deer. And, it is right there dead in center of yer eye front sight centered in the ring every time ya snap the gun up.

 

[Sharps40]

Use the base and Prussian Blue to spot in the rough location of the mounting screws. Level lines and centers will be scribed later based off the single red dot.

6x48 holes are drilled and tapped and the mount is given a final jitterbug finish with worn 220g. The base will be Rust Blackened with Laurel Mountain Forge Brown for a non glare finish.

Mount the base to the adapter. Loctite will be used on the attachment screws after the final finish.

Mount the assembly to the gun.

Install the sight and bottom it for now, first measurements will be taken with the crossbar down on the receiver bridge. It'll get 12 clicks of elevation later for its baseline (keeping the cross slider from marking the receiver/binding on the receiver top) and the slider will be set at zero.

With measurement, shaping and careful spotting of holes, the cross arm is well centered over the 1" thick receiver thus giving maximum windage capability at the aft end.

Lots of room for the thumb with any of the possible discs installed, and tons of room with the discs removed for hunting.

 

[Sharps40]

Made a buncha measurements, made a buncha calculations. Good news.....we should not need a ridiculously tall front sight of .65 to .8ish.

The receiver sight center height was measured bottomed on the bridge and again 12 clicks (one full turn) up. I set the Mod 66U sight at 12 clicks up and zeroed it at the 0 mark. It can now be removed and returned to this base setting - which equates to nothing since the gun is yet to be sighted. Once properly zeroed (distance) I'll again set the slide to zero, so it can be removed and returned to that distance setting at will and quickly. From there, we will have plenty in the way of elevation and windage adjustment.

For the most part, Calculations between receiver and barrel sight (a Marbles folding, windage and elevation adjustable model) indicate a front sight height in the range of .410 to .450 should work out. I'll probably make a try sight of .5" and file it in while shooting and see if I can get dead on to 2" low at 100 with the Marbles folder first, then there should be no problems with the receiver sight as it has a range of elevation and depression and can be zeroed out where ever I want it. (likely 2" or so high at 100 for Point blank to 175ish yards easy).

In any event, the Marbles folder installed. Quick into play, out of the way when not needed and a set and forget style. Great for snaps in heavy brush and shorter ranges, etc.

A few minutes was spent putting all the sights in the same plane, using the front as the reference point for now. Basically, with the barrel sight up and the blade centered, a straight line from front blade, thru the groove in the Marbles Folder go's through the center of the peep on the Lyman 66U.

It may not be zeroed but for a trip to the range, at 50 and 100 yards, both rear sights should hit close to the same spot on the target. Sight up and down, the camera can barely focus the blade.....the eye focuses it from the shoulder.....I guess eyes is still better in some ways than cameras.

 

[Sharps40]

Federal 170g PowerShok (my favoritest 3030 ammo) ranges somewhat as follows:

Average Zero: +.3" at 50 yards --- 0" at 100 yards --- -8.4" at 200 yards --- -30" at 300 yards. So....A 200 yard maximum range.

Long Range Zero: +2.4" at 50 yards --- +4.2" at 100 yards -- 0" at 200 yards --- -17.4" at 300 yards --- -53.5" at 400 yards --- -114.4" at 500 yards (This is a poor zero for 3030....too high at 100 yards and you will very often miss high at closer ranges.....I split the difference and sight 2" high at 100 with the 3030 and feel comfortable aiming dead on out to 150 odd yards, and you don't get high hits and misses at close range.)

Looking at Federal Powershok 150g......supposedly faster/flatter.......is it more than a 150 to 200 yard cartridge for most folks?

Average Zero: +.1" at 50 yards --- 0" at 100 yards --- -7.2" at 200 yards --- -26.7" at 300 yards. So, a 200 yard maximum range with about 1.25" less drop. My misaiming will make more difference than that.

Long Range Zero: +1.9" at 50 yards --- + 3.6" at 100 yards --- 0" at 200 yards --- -15.9" at 300 yards --- -50.1" at 400 yards --- -109.8" at 500 yards. So, this load is 1.5" flatter at 200 yards than the same zero with a 170g load. Again, my mistakes will be larger than that. And, this is still a higher probability of close range misses high since the initial curve is greater than 3" high at 100 yards. Again, I'd split the difference, zero not more than 2" high at 100 and be comfortable aiming dead center to 150 odd yards.

The main difference for me between 150 and 170g bullets in the 3030? (no I don't shoot gummy bear tips as they cost too dayum much).....I have always found 170s to be more accurate in every 3030 I have ever fired. And that is an unqualified statement. For me, 170s have always outshot 150s.

 

[Sharps40]

Twas winter and the rifle laid

Rusting slow upon Smiths bench:

All critics typed "You Hack" to slay,

And the Wannabe's cried STENCH!



"Beware the Armchair King, my son!

The words that bite, the posts that catch!

Beware the Know It All, and shun

The Imperious Keyboard Klatch!"



He took his bastard file in hand:

Long time the churlish foe he sought --

So rested he by the work shop stand,

And stood awhile in thought.



And, as in deepest thought he stood,

The Armchair King, with eyes of flame,

Came snorting through the transistered woods,

And burbled as it came!



One, two! One, two! And grind through red

The bastard file went snicker-snack!

He left it dead, and with its head

He went galumphing back.



"And, has thou slain the Armchair King?

Come to my arms, my beamish boy!

O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'

He chortled in his joy.



Twas winter and the rifle laid

Rusting slow upon Smiths bench:

All critics typed "You Hack" to slay,

And the Wannabe's cried STENCH!

 

[Sharps40]

Well....since I gotta shoot this thing in and validate the front sight calculations, figgered no sense takin the receiver sight on and off. Just get it rust blackened and put it on once and for all.

So, into the damp box. Humidity holding at 85% and with the crock pot in the bottom perkin, about 80 odd degrees inside. A good first bloom of rust. About 730 I'll boil and card and sauce it again for the slow overnight rusting.

Mebby have it looking good out back for a trip to the range this weekend.

 

[Sharps40]

In for the first water boil to change red rust to black magnetite. First pass or two is usually a translucent light grey. A good place to stop if matching a new or recently cleaned original part to a very old grey finish. We'll keep going till its a satin grey black.

Just water, straight from the tap and a 10 minute boil.

After carding with 0000 steel wool, whats left is tuff and will out last hot tank blue. But, not dark enough yet. An overnight rust will help grey this up fine, so, back in the box to sit rusting till 5 AM.

 

[awp101]

So, into the damp box. Humidity holding at 85% and with the crock pot in the bottom perkin, about 80 odd degrees inside.

Using the crock pot can you still control the humidity? I'm guessing by adjusting how much of the lid covers the pot?

 

[Sharps40]

Yep, lid....vents in box, crock temp range of warm, low, med and high. Etc. Temps not so much a worry, usually anything above 60F works fine if the humidity is maintained. I don't like to get the humidity much over 80% unless I'm looking for a rough browned finish.

 

[Sharps40]

Done and on. A grease shim between the mount and receiver bridge. Blue Loctite on all the screws and synched well and good for the long haul.

A spot of rust on the sight slide....its old. The gun is old and has its own rust boogers. I'll leave the slide as is, it matches.

Right now the slide is "Zeroed" at 12 clicks (1 full revolution) above the bridge. It'll get changed later but it only takes a second to line up the mid points of the zeros and you are sure you are back to your start point. Nicely repeatable and finely tunable. (Gun grease picks up dog hair.....oh well, won't make the gun weigh more in the long run!)

A good tight fit. Will play around with the front and barrel sight now while doing some initial shooting. 170s for me....ain't got no lighter ones.

The old weaver head screws off another waffle top marlin are aged too.....the lightly worn look kinda looks right as many other screws on this one show some wear and tear. I cleaned em only and put em in.

 

[Sharps40]

We know the Rocky Mountain front sight is not original since the blade is not soldered in. A not to strong yank removes the blade from the base. Here before disassembly with the trimmed Indian Head Nickel which will become the new front sight.

The soldering surfaces are roughed up with 120g and fluxed and tinned with solder.

After tinning, the surfaces of the fresh solder are again cleaned and fluxed and the sight blade assembled in the Rocky Mountain sight base.

Using a small flame and approaching soldering temperature slowly, the parts are mated. Here after some light clean up.

The new "Coin" front sight, Chingochgook looking out over the muzzle, establishing a trim line with a file. I left the front sight just a hair taller than .500", room for trimming and different loads too. But, all calculations are based on the rear barrel sight. Its range of elevation adjustment should be about right.....we'll see.

Another pair of views....

 

[Jimbo357mag]

I like everything except the front sight. That's just a little weird to me.

How can this page 1 be so long?

 

[Sharps40]

Started at 25. Working to rough zero both barrel and peep sight.

For reference, the red squares are 3 1/8" size. So the gun is shooting small all the way out to 100 yards.....very good.

Peep site is always the top square. Barrel sight is always the bottom square. Points of aim are indicated.

25 Yards: First three in the bottom square using the flip up barrel sight. Only had to make one elevation adjustment and it was where I wanted it to be....folding down the barrel sight I installed the peep and made several adjustments to walk it up to the upper square till I had it about right.

50 Yards: Two good shots in the bottom square with the barrel sight, no adjustments required. A bit left but that can be tweaked later. For now.....done with the flip up barrel sight. This is a good rough setting for snap shooting deer and will serve minute of deer easily to 100 yards. Done.

Then, Reinstalled the peep. No changes in elevation, just fired four and its hitting about on top of the front sight. No adjustments needed on the peep yet and next I'll move back to 100 yards.

100 yards: 2 shots fired thru the peep aiming just between the red squares....they are really small at 100 yards and my eyes ain't what they used to be....but, no adjustments to the peep and the results as shown.

The front sight has enough meat in it that it could be lowered another 40 thousands or so if lowered positioning of the rear sights is desired for looks. But, over all, its time to select the hunting load (and the Federal Power Shok loads look like they have the accuracy potential) and spend a few sessions on the bench and shooting from kneeling, squatting and off hand at targets up to 200 yards.

The final shots were three hits of three fired at the 150 yard gong. No sight adjustments needed. Probably a bit low there but, once the gun is final tuned to about 2" high at 100 yards it should be no problem to aim centered on a deers chest and make a solid hit to 200ish yards.

Oh yeah,,,,,this gun don't kick. Even with the crescent buttplate.....very nice and given todays light work in the cold and high wind, should be a fine fine shooter.

 

[Pistolero]

Very nice work!

 

[Del J]

You did very well on your project. Thanks for posting. I like those old Marlin's.

 

[Joe S.]

Cool!!

I may have missed it but why not just drill and tap side of receiver?

 

[Joe S.]

The peep that came on it was a Skinner "Lo-pro" or similar I do believe.

http://www.skinnersights.com/lo-pro_sight_7.html