Bisley flat top pawl
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Now I get it. Been doing homework since I posted this question. Saw the different pawls on Brownells etc. couldn't figure it out. I'm doing a conversion on a Bisley. Going to use a hunter gf, standard trigger, and sbh hammer. I'm still not sure if I'll need a regular nmbh pawl or if the Bisley pawl will work with the sbh hammer. I'll pull the Bisley (med. frame) and the BH (large frame) both apart and compare. They both have to come apart anyway, I munched the pawl spring on the BH upon reassembly, got a couple of new ones and other parts ready to do conversion. I'm guessing the small spur on the bottom of the Bisley (medium frame) rides on a boss in the cyl frame and replaces the spring loaded pawl that on the large frame.
I'm probably a moron for destroying a perfectly good Bisley, but I overpaid for it, and and don't like the look or feel at all.
Hey Hunter! I'm in Cedar!
I'm probably a moron for destroying a perfectly good Bisley, but I overpaid for it, and and don't like the look or feel at all.
Hey Hunter! I'm in Cedar!
Hondo44
Hawkeye
The different (free spin) pawl with the spur has nothing to do with the grip frame style or main frame size. It's for the New Vaquero mid and large frames and NM Flat top Blackhawk mid and large frames; both of which have the RIPS (Ruger Indexing Pawl System) cyl alignment.
So there's two sizes of pawls with the spur. All pawls use the same pawl plunger and spring.
1.) Reverse Indexing Pawl System:
All the NM FT Blackhawks and NEW Vaqs have this system which allows the cyl to roll backwards enough and stop for the chambers to align to the loading gate trough without the hammer on half cock (which can't be done on standard new models). You can see the device (3 parts) in the hammer channel to the lower left of the cyl pin hole shown below. Grip frames from models w/o this system need a divot cut above the trigger guard for the free spin cyl pawl.
Ruger free spin pawl on the right:
Divot for free spin pawl on NM Flat Tops and New Vaqueros with the reverse indexing pawl system shown on the left:
Cutting the divot: To locate this notch, take a measurement from the location on your original GF. Or mark that area on the replacement GF with a magic marker, assemble the GF to the gun, then cock the hammer a few times. This will leave a 'witness' mark in the marker ink, so you simply make the "divot" there. Be cautious not to let the cut extend to the outside edge of the grip frame or it will show when assembled, and don't cut notch too deep!
Use a thin cut-off blade in a Dremel tool. With grip frame in a vice, and your old grip frame nearby for reference, hold the Dremel with two hands for control. And replicate the divot in the new grip frame. It's easier to clamp the Dremel tool in the vice at an angle and hold the grip frame instead.
2.) Grip Frame Projections:
Shown here on a Bisley GF pointing to the right just above the two rear trigger guard screws and both sides of where the hammer base would be. To fit grip frames with projections to guns w/o the cut out in the cyl frame, just saw or grind off the projections, they are not needed on steel grip frames:
Photo by G2.
3.) MY SHORTCUT FOR REMOVING JUST HAMMER and/or PAWL in New Models:
Recognize, when JUST NEEDING to remove the hammer and/or pawl, you do not need to hassle with the PESKY LOADING GATE SPRING, pull the trigger pin, OR trigger/transfer bar. Once you remove the grip frame, the hammer pin is the only other part you need to remove. After that, just pull the hammer back and all the way down, then depress the hammer plunger in the base of the hammer with a small tipped screwdriver to clear the trigger extension where the transfer bar connects to it. Let the hammer & pawl fall out. Reinstall the hammer and pawl back in the same way they came out. Push the plunger in by pushing it against the trigger extension just like you did with the tip of the small screwdriver, and the hammer will slip by the trigger extension. Piece o' cake.
Occasionally a hammer change that doesn't cock or just barely cocks is because it's hitting the back of the slot in the grip frame. I have had to slightly lengthen the slot with a few file strokes.
If either the trigger or hammer pin are snug fits, after they're removed the first time, it's the opportunity to polish them so they're slip fits to put back in and remove the next time.
So there's two sizes of pawls with the spur. All pawls use the same pawl plunger and spring.
1.) Reverse Indexing Pawl System:
All the NM FT Blackhawks and NEW Vaqs have this system which allows the cyl to roll backwards enough and stop for the chambers to align to the loading gate trough without the hammer on half cock (which can't be done on standard new models). You can see the device (3 parts) in the hammer channel to the lower left of the cyl pin hole shown below. Grip frames from models w/o this system need a divot cut above the trigger guard for the free spin cyl pawl.
Ruger free spin pawl on the right:
Divot for free spin pawl on NM Flat Tops and New Vaqueros with the reverse indexing pawl system shown on the left:
Cutting the divot: To locate this notch, take a measurement from the location on your original GF. Or mark that area on the replacement GF with a magic marker, assemble the GF to the gun, then cock the hammer a few times. This will leave a 'witness' mark in the marker ink, so you simply make the "divot" there. Be cautious not to let the cut extend to the outside edge of the grip frame or it will show when assembled, and don't cut notch too deep!
Use a thin cut-off blade in a Dremel tool. With grip frame in a vice, and your old grip frame nearby for reference, hold the Dremel with two hands for control. And replicate the divot in the new grip frame. It's easier to clamp the Dremel tool in the vice at an angle and hold the grip frame instead.
2.) Grip Frame Projections:
Shown here on a Bisley GF pointing to the right just above the two rear trigger guard screws and both sides of where the hammer base would be. To fit grip frames with projections to guns w/o the cut out in the cyl frame, just saw or grind off the projections, they are not needed on steel grip frames:
Photo by G2.
3.) MY SHORTCUT FOR REMOVING JUST HAMMER and/or PAWL in New Models:
Recognize, when JUST NEEDING to remove the hammer and/or pawl, you do not need to hassle with the PESKY LOADING GATE SPRING, pull the trigger pin, OR trigger/transfer bar. Once you remove the grip frame, the hammer pin is the only other part you need to remove. After that, just pull the hammer back and all the way down, then depress the hammer plunger in the base of the hammer with a small tipped screwdriver to clear the trigger extension where the transfer bar connects to it. Let the hammer & pawl fall out. Reinstall the hammer and pawl back in the same way they came out. Push the plunger in by pushing it against the trigger extension just like you did with the tip of the small screwdriver, and the hammer will slip by the trigger extension. Piece o' cake.
Occasionally a hammer change that doesn't cock or just barely cocks is because it's hitting the back of the slot in the grip frame. I have had to slightly lengthen the slot with a few file strokes.
If either the trigger or hammer pin are snug fits, after they're removed the first time, it's the opportunity to polish them so they're slip fits to put back in and remove the next time.
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