Advice for hunting loads for .357 Vaquero

[coloradofarmboy]

I am thinking about carrying my .357 vaquero with me when I hunt big game in Colorado this autumn. The primary purpose being backup and also to use if I am in a place where it is much easier to shoot quickly at short range with my revolver, rather than my rifle.

Colorado state law requires that a handgun be able to generate 550 ft/lbs at 50 yards. This is just a bit much for the .357 in general. Buffalo Bore makes some heavy .357 ammunition which in theory should be strong enough: http://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l= ... tail&p=102

My questions:

1. Is this kind of ammunition safe to fire in a Vaquero?

2. If it is safe, are there any other premium loads that I should consider?

Many thanks for any advice you can give.

 

[Redstick]

WELCOME to the Ruger Forum, coloradofarmboy!
The Vaquero will handle any factory load out there, even the "RUGER ONLY" loads, 'cause it's a Ruger! I cain't say the same for the New Vaquero...

 

[coloradofarmboy]

WELCOME to the Ruger Forum, coloradofarmboy!
The Vaquero will handle any factory load out there, even the "RUGER ONLY" loads, 'cause it's a Ruger! I cain't say the same for the New Vaquero...

Thanks. This is a New Vaquero with the 5.5" barrel. In theory the Buffalo Bore ammunition is within Colorado specifications, but as this is a hot load, I just want to do a confidence check that the New Vaquero can handle it.

 

[Redstick]

The NEW VAQUERO will not handle the heavy loads the VAQUERO can shoot. They're two different guns - "VAQUERO" and "NEW VAQUERO".

But the stuff you're lookin' at would be fine in the NEW VAQUERO. "This ammo is safe to shoot in ANY all steel 357 revolver..." So you'd be fine with it.

 

[coloradofarmboy]

The NEW VAQUERO will not handle the heavy loads the VAQUERO can shoot. They're two different guns - "VAQUERO" and "NEW VAQUERO".

I understand the difference between the old and new model, but my question is whether Buffalo Bore ammunition is too much for the New Vaquero. Buffalo Bore's website states:

"This ammo is safe to shoot in ANY all steel 357 revolver - this includes J frames. This ammo is no harder on your gun than any other normal 357 ammo. Please don't phone us and ask if this ammo is safe in your gun. It is, providing your gun is in safe condition for use with any normal 357 ammo."

I'm not a reloader and I don't know if I trust general statements like this, so I thought I would try to find some Ruger experts who could refute or verify this statement.

 

[Redstick]

Yeah; it'd be just fine. Even a J-Frame can shoot this stuff.
It also said, "the ammo itself wont hurt these super light weight revolvers.", talking about super light alloy revolvers, so there'd be NO WORRY shooting it in the NEW VAQUERO.

 

[Knuckles]

I thought it was only the .45LC New Vaqueros... I never heard of the .357mag New Vaqueros having limitations. :?

Somebody straighten me out with some hard evidence please.

 

[JimMarch1]

OK, let's be clear:

The "Old Vaquero" is "overbuilt" for the 357Mag, by a huge factor. That's because it's a 44Magnum-class gun. However, trying to USE the extra strength available is tricky as hell even for a good handloader. Why? Because when you get close to "the edge" of what a cartridge can do, you get to a point where very small additions in powder create fairly large jumps in pressure.

In other words, the pressure curve (upwards) as you add powder isn't a nice even line. It's a vicious curve. Trying to climb further up that curve, you're playing in the "steep" portion and things can go wrong in a hurry - small mistakes lead to big problems.

I wouldn't try it myself. And NO manufacturers have tried either - there's no such thing as "Ruger ONLY!!!" 357 loads. There IS some very hot loading info out there (websites only) for the 357 large-frame Ruger Blackhawks (or the 5,000 or so 357 Redhawks in existence), but it's a bit dated and I don't think I'd trust it.

The New Vaquero's cylinder in 357 isn't as beefy as the OldVaq, but it's still fatter and more solid than a GP100's cylinder - and GP100s are not known as "weak" guns!!! So there's NO factory 357 load out there that a New Vaquero can't eat. My daily carry gun is a NewVaq357, and my load is Doubletap's rocket-hot 125gr based on the Gold Dot. You can absolutely run the gnarliest Buffalo Bore, Doubletap or Grizzly Ammo loads you can find through a NewVaq357, same as you can a modern Colt SAA in 357, or for that matter a GP100, S&W 686 or the like.

 

[coloradofarmboy]

OK, let's be clear:
You can absolutely run the gnarliest Buffalo Bore, Doubletap or Grizzly Ammo loads you can find through a NewVaq357, same as you can a modern Colt SAA in 357, or for that matter a GP100, S&W 686 or the like.

This is what I needed to hear. Thanks!

 

[JimMarch1]

If you're going to play with very hot loads, consider applying one of the two known fixes to the "base pin can jump out under heavy recoil" problem.

Solution one is a Belt Mountain base pin with a set-screw to lock the pin down. Costs about $25, a bit more if you go with the fancier #5 pin.

Option two is a good spring kit that includes a stronger spring on the base pin release latch. Typically costs about $20 including a lighter trigger return spring and usually two or three lighter mainsprings.

I went with the spring kit.

 

[coloradofarmboy]

Option two is a good spring kit that includes a stronger spring on the base pin release latch. Typically costs about $20 including a lighter trigger return spring and usually two or three lighter mainsprings.

Do you have a recommended website that you could point me to for this?

 

[JimMarch1]

Yeah, I usually use Wolff:

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/sid=4867 ... ooters_Pak

BUT, the "magic springs" are starting to get some attention, tuned for each caliber (!):

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/cid=1946 ... ro_Springs

Problem is, you can't get the stouter base pin latch spring on it's own just because it would be too cheap to sell on it's own. So to get that, you need a complete kit. I think *somewhere* you can find the whole kit (stronger latch spring, weaker trigger return and main springs) with a Magic mainspring but I don't know where.

I found the Wolff to be quite nice but supposedly, the "magic" in the Magic spring is that it's the same tension across it's range...no "stacking" at the end.

 

[CraigC]

Jim's right, when chambered in .357Mag, there are no strength concerns with the New Vaquero. They are stronger than the GP, S&W K and L frames and arguable more durable than N-frame S&W's. Same for Colt SAA's and replicas. There is no better single action platform for the .357.