Not to stir up a hornet's nest, but....

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This thread is about 1911's, not just Ruger 1911's. I've owned guns for most of my life, and for a number of years had an Army issued 1911 45acp for military use (although admittedly I didn't shoot it much beyond a couple of times a year) and have never understood the almost reverential awe that some gun owners hold for the 1911 design. It certainly was a good, workable design, but what makes it special to so many folks? My Ruger PC97 had never, ever had a single problem, nor have I had any problems with the reliability and accuracy of any of the Glocks I own, while my one and only Kimber (a 1911 design) was plagued by problem which resulted in me getting rid of that gun. I have no problem with anyone owning anything that they like, and the 1911 is certainly a good design that has stood the test of time, but when I read of some who think that NOTHING but the 1911 is worth having, I am puzzled. Set me straight.
 

Snake45

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Sorry to hear you had problems with your Kimber. If it had run smoothly, you might have a different opinion of the 1911 design in general.
 
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The Kimber I had was the smallest one they made at the time, but I don't recall what it was called. I think it was the Ultra Carry. The gun looked great, felt great, and had very manageable recoil for such a small gun. But it had constant FTF and FTE, despite two trips back to Kimber and using only high quality factory ammo. I really had hoped that the Kimber would be my life long every day carry but it was not to be. I later was told that the problem was likely the short 3 inch barrel and that the longer barrel Kimbers did not have the same problems.
 

Snake45

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vito said:
The Kimber I had was the smallest one they made at the time, but I don't recall what it was called. I think it was the Ultra Carry. The gun looked great, felt great, and had very manageable recoil for such a small gun. But it had constant FTF and FTE, despite two trips back to Kimber and using only high quality factory ammo. I really had hoped that the Kimber would be my life long every day carry but it was not to be. I later was told that the problem was likely the short 3 inch barrel and that the longer barrel Kimbers did not have the same problems.
I have no doubt the 3" barrel was the main problem. Long story short, I did some experimenting with shortened 1911s back in the '80s and came to the conclusion that I'd never personally trust one shorter than 4".

My son has a Kimber with a 4" or 4.25" barrel and the short grip frame. I don't know how reliable it is (but I've never heard him complain about it, nor has he ever asked me for tuning help with it) but I can tell you that stupid little gun has, far and away, THE BEST trigger I've ever felt on a 1911, and I've handled my share of match-grade target guns. :shock:
 

hittman

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The Ford Model T was a game changer. Not only for that industry but for our society. I dont want one as my every day driver.

The 1911 is no different.

The 1911 made its mark and its reputation was helped greatly by 2 world wars.

I think Vito is right on track here.

Its not that the 1911 is a century old design, rather its limited magazine capacity, bulky size and complicated take-down procedures.

My favorite 1911 is the Ruger lightweight Commander in 9mm. The 2 other 1911s here were just too cheap to pass up at the time.

Regardless, I'll still choose a Sig P220 or CZ75 or about any Glock over a 1911.
 
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vito said:
I have no problem with anyone owning anything that they like, and the 1911 is certainly a good design that has stood the test of time, but when I read of some who think that NOTHING but the 1911 is worth having, I am puzzled. Set me straight.

No need to set you, or anyone else straight. For every gadget there's a fan base. Ford. Chevy, Dodge, Colt, S&W, Ruger, and even Ginger and Mary Ann. Granted, some folks get a little carried away with their love for their favorite at the expense of all others, but so what? I kinda like 'em all, while certain ones get a little more respect from me than others, but i'm not about to claim total superiority for my favorite of favorites. Others may do so, and I'll just ignore them. Life's too darn short to get all wrapped around the axle over what somebody else thinks about this or that specific gadget. We can hold that over for the Political subforum. :wink:

JMHO
 

NikA

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vito said:
The gun looked great, felt great, and had very manageable recoil for such a small gun. But it had constant FTF and FTE

Sounds like you like 1911s in principle but had a particularly bad example.

I find the 1911 to be a comfortable platform to shoot. I've looked for other .45 platforms with higher capacity, but not really found anything with enough additional capacity to justify the significant extra bulkiness in the grip.

I have a number of other platforms for other calibers; I find the 1911 design to be particularly suited to .45. I have a preference for .45 in handguns because I find the recoil to not be overly snappy and it is inherently subsonic and operates at lower pressure.
 
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Well the way I see it everyone forms their own opinion based on their own experience. Now I've used only two types of handguns for service use. They were a 1911A1 and a Hi Power. Both worked, but the 1911A1 instilled more confidence. So my opinion is that the 1911A1 is the best self defense semiauto.
 

mistermills357

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I have a Colt .45 1911 and it works pretty well, and when I got it, I promised myself that I would keep it.
I have had a Ruger P97 .45 and I thought that it was a pretty good gun. I ended up giving it to an old GF, because I wanted her to have a good gun.

I am very confident when I have my 1911.
 

Cholo

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My favorite auto loader is the 1911 in 45 ACP. All the rest are just tools, though I do kinda like my CZ 75B.

I don't doubt there's something to the under 4.25" not being as reliable, though it's not been my experience with a 3" Kimber Eclipse and a 3" Colt Defender. Both are 100% reliable no matter what I feed them. The Colt is my daily carry gun in cooler weather. I trust my life, and my family's lives, with it.

I have a new holster coming in about a month for a S&W Shield Plus, but I'm getting the feeling it won't be carried much. I just like my cocked and locked 45 with its eight 230 grain cannonballs :)
 

Snake45

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hittman said:
The Ford Model T was a game changer. Not only for that industry but for our society. I dont want one as my every day driver.

Its not that the 1911 is a century old design, rather its limited magazine capacity, bulky size and complicated take-down procedures.

My favorite 1911 is the Ruger lightweight Commander in 9mm. The 2 other 1911s here were just too cheap to pass up at the time.

Regardless, I'll still choose a Sig P220 or CZ75 or about any Glock over a 1911.
The wheel is also an ancient design, but I haven't noticed many substantial improvements on the basic theme.

The single action revolver, the DA revolver, the lever action rifle, the bolt action centerfire rifle and the pump shotgun are all direct or indirect descendants of designs even older than the 1911, but I'd be willing to bet you have at least a few of these in your "working gun" battery and don't consider them obsolete at all. :wink:

I'd consider the SIG 220, CZ75 and Glock all to be bulkier than the 1911. The 1911 might be slightly more complicated to field-strip than those three, but I'll guarantee it's MUCH easier to detail-strip than any of them. Probably easier to get and replace parts on, too. :wink:
 

hittman

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Wheels used to be made of wood so there's that. :lol:

I think we agree that grip size, shape and angle are a personal preference thing. I guess shooters with smaller hands may like the 1911 more since it's pretty thin. I get along fine with all grip shapes and sizes but maybe I'm just not particular enough.

A standard 1911 is 39 ounces, P220 is 30 and G21 is 26. Of course having a loaded mag in each would surely even up the weight difference some.

Oh, and I dont consider the 1911 obsolete. I just dont have the nostalgic love affair some do when there are (to me) better options available.
 
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I think the 1911 is a great gun, along with the Hi-Power, the SAA, a couple of the S&W classics, and the CZ75. If I had to take only one handgun for any realistic purposes I might have it would likely be a G19.

But for sheer good feeling in the hand I'll take almost anything in an XR3-RED. :wink:
 

kwh

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It could be said J.M. Bowning designed the 1911 around the 230 gr round nose hardball bullet. Grip angle, throat, magazine design, feeding angle follower, feed lips, design of extractor,etc were based on the reliability of this bullet only. Any other change in ogive can/will change reliability.
 

Snake45

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kwh said:
It could be said J.M. Bowning designed the 1911 around the 230 gr round nose hardball bullet. Grip angle, throat, magazine design, feeding angle follower, feed lips, design of extractor,etc were based on the reliability of this bullet only. Any other change in ogive can/will change reliability.
And yet most 1911s run most modern bullet shapes reliably, or can be made to with minor adjustments. I've put something over 25K rounds of flat-nosed lead semiwadcutters through 1911s of various kinds and can't recall a single failure to feed.
 

Mike J

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My 1911 experience is very limited. The only one I own or have shot is my 5" SR 1911. I did have to change the tension on the extractor when I first got it. After that it has been fine. I honestly like it a lot. I just usually don't carry it because of the weight or bulk. I've found myself moving from one compact striker fired pistol to another for carry for several years now. They work for me. They aren't as nice or as fun to shoot as a 1911 though.
 

Pat-inCO

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loaded round said:
Say whatever you want about this pistol....it just works when you need it!
Agree! But I'll add "if you have broken it in properly".

1 To me that is field strip, wipe down, LIGHTLY oil, reassemble.
2 Then hand cycle the slide a few hundred times (NO magazine AND you do NOT
let the slide slam home.
3 Field strip again, wipe down, VERY lightly oil it and reassemble.
4 Check the smoothness of the slide action. If not S M O O T H, repeat number one and two
(for me that is one time, MOST times)
~ Detail strip, clean, oil lightly (I use FP10 but many others work well) and I use
Slip Stream on the rails for re-assembly.

I then do a sequence of dry fire (ride the hammer down if you like) until the release is smooth
(most time it will take less than 100 times) but repeat until it is smooth.

Detail strip again, clean, lightly oil, (once again I use Slip Stream on the rails) AND
then take it to the range. Enjoy!

I've had only a very few that did not respond to that process. Some are so good, from the
factory, that the above process is less than a half hour.
 
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