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PostPosted: Wed Jul 21, 2021 8:27 am 
Blackhawk

Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:28 pm
Posts: 733
Location: New Hampshire,"live free or die"
Hello, been chasing this issue for a while. Picked up some new magazines years ago they happened to be Chip McCormick is 7 round got 2 and 1 of his Power Plus 8 Round for my officers Colt. Took it to the range and I had not been to the range for a while"years" the gun just been sitting there. And that's one of the first times it burped in the sense that fairly regularly the slide with lock open with some rounds left to fire. Gun has always been put away meticulously cleaned and lubed. Also if I hadn't used it in a while I Field Strip clean and Lube the gun which I did before this outing.

It would usually be multiple rounds three or four. Did not go through the trouble of trying out the regular Colt mags again since. I know stupid. I installed a wolf extra tension plunger spring with two new plungers in the plunger tube. I also threw a Wilson new slide stop at it was supposed to be fitted it's not the bulletproof one. I checked fit as usual with the recoil spring out slide off the gun and in fact the hollow points I'm using using was contacting the tip the slide stop so kept file in that back. Never could get to the point where a bullet wouldn't hit that when I slid the magazine in. Yep you guessed it eventually slide would not lock open on an empty mag. Well I didn't think of this when I slid the Meg in all the pressure is on one side of the magazine pushing it towards the slide release and when the Meg is inserted into the gun and catches it's loose in there so I guess a better check would be Slide the Meg in when it passes the magazine catch but didn't engage hold mag with one hand while pushing in on mag release and move the magazine in and out to check fitment all of the slide stop. When I did it that way it did not engage with the FMJ ball ammo bullet tip even though it was closed. I ordered another slide stop from Wilson installed it and filled it down as much as I dared while still allowing it to hold to slide open when empty. Also even though with regular Full Metal Jacket ball ammo it did not contact the slide stop. Yet the slide would locked open with rounds left to be fired . My way of thinking is that with the timing of the pistol it is a short-barreled gun 3 and 1/2 in even if the slide stop was engaging the nose of a bullet in the magazine it's timing should be off long enough that it shouldn't affect it when the slide goes fully to the rear the next bullet should be up in the magazine fully and nowhere near the slide stop. I'm have not fired the gun yet I have to find a place I don't have a range permit at the moment.

I'm going to fire it with the Colt magazines before I try the Chip McCormick magazines again and see if I can get a repeatable problem with the gun and find out why. But with this timing issue that I'm talking about could someone tell me if I am correct in the sense the gun should be out of time most of it's slide movement even if it's slide stop nose is contacting the tip of a bullet it cannot hold the slide open until it is fully to the rear and by that time the next bullet should be up pulley resting on the magazine lips. These are brand new magazines with brand new Springs. Hard to trace the problem at this point in time and not be able just to step right out and fire the gun. Sorry this is so long this should be a very simple problem as with my other 1911s but with this officers model for some reason it's not.

One other thing that I will mention I did notice when someone else was firing the gun oh, yes they had the same issue with feeding and Meg walking open before it was empty. But what I was starting to say was what I could notice was that when the gun was rejecting the rounds Winchester white box and some reloads most of the rounds would eject straight in the air not that awful High some forward of the gun. I checked the ejector it's 100%.

I thought this was unusual check my extractor pulled it out everything's nice and clean as a whistle in the gun and the extractor tension seems pretty good looking at my extractor angles with a Jeweler's loupe they look good. Scratch head! I'm too stubborn to use another gun for my nightstand!

I know this is long and I'm sorry last thoughts I had three other people fire the gun having the same issues. This was my go-to gun even though I haven't shot it for years I've shot this gun single-handed we crested Every Witch Way it could be fired never an issue with the gun before this.

Even though three separate people fired the gun I think one of my next steps is to take the gun out someplace put a Colt magazine in it and shoot at least 50 rounds with that single magazine if no problems maybe switch to a Chip McCormick magazine repeat after 50 rounds no problems with the other the Power Plus if I get to a point where there's problems maybe I have isolated it. But I will do this giving concentration to my hold on the gun regarding not bumping slide stop under recoil! I've never had this problem but I can't say for a fact being I didn't fire the gun for a while that was not the issue. Even with the other people shooting the gun I did not watch them on that side of the gun he needs a while shooting.

Sorry I am using my phone I can't see well with my current glasses and I know my speech to text on this phone is something to be desired. I tried to correct some of the problems but hopefully they can be read around!! I think I probably covered everything and then some. Any help or ideas would be appreciated!! George

PS holy crap this is long! Sorry!


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 21, 2021 9:19 am 
Hawkeye
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Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2009 5:27 pm
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George wrote:
I'm too stubborn to use another gun for my nightstand!

Bad idea. Very, VERY bad idea. :?

If you insist on relying on this thing for personal defense before you get its problems sorted out, AT LEAST develop the habit of shooting it with your left thumb holding down the slide stop HARD. :wink:

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 21, 2021 10:02 am 
Blackhawk

Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:28 pm
Posts: 733
Location: New Hampshire,"live free or die"
Snake, thanks for the reply! You're absolutely 110% right. I do keep another on that nightstand also it's just that this office has always been a hundred percent reliable and always by my side . so I kind of like to have it there. Yep I have run the gun before at the range with my thumb on the slide lock to get through a range session! But great advice thanks! After I get this gun out once again I'm going to give it a thorough shake down as best I can it's not like I don't know anything about these things. I just haven't had the place nor time be able to shoot this thing. With any luck this weekend I got a sand pit I can go to. Amount the ammunition I have to put through it is not an issue as long as I can say it's a hundred percent. There's a slight possibility after going through all this I might be me manipulating that slide stop myself under recoil oh, this is the reason why I had other people shoot it. Been shooting so many other guns and hadn't had this gun out like I said for years. So it's possible I am going to make absolutely sure I'm not doing that on this next outing and get at least 50 rounds through every magazine. See what happens. If I still have issues I can't isolate I will grit teeth stubborn son of a b i m take it to A Smith! I've got a Smith & Wesson Compact 40 with the 4 in Barrel that I can use for my Main nightstand gun. Heck I've got another one of these, a twin if you will but but it kind of gives me a bad taste in my mouth at the moment even though it was a hundred percent reliable. No shortage of what I can use here. Just wanted to go over everything I did and what tried. I know for my issue essentially it's a short list of problems that can cause that issues. But my post tend to be long-winded! Again thank you for your reply. Will take your advice! George


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 22, 2021 6:21 am 
Buckeye

Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 11:51 am
Posts: 1341
You can close the slide with the loaded magazine removed and the slide stop disengaged. Next insert the loaded magazine. If the slide stop moves in the direction of engagement when the magazine gets close to the point of locking, it is being contacted by the ammunition or the magazine. Most times after some use there will be copper wipe on the slide stop where it is occurring. If you can insert the loaded magazine and the slide stop remains in the disengaged position with no movement, it is not the slide stop causing the problem. The only thing that should engage the slide stop is the magazine follower with no rounds in the magazine.
In that case I would check the magazine lock/release to see if it was putting pressure on the magazine that moved it toward the slide stop while the gun is operating.
I would try to create the situation with the original magazines and ammunition when it ran without problems. It could be ammunition or magazine or both causing your problem.
I had an officers model that locked up the first time out of the box. When I removed the barrel and plunk tested the ammo, it was the ammo and not the gun. The ammo was beautiful to look at, but did not fit that gun. That was what caused me to try and learn all I could about 1911's. I was always a revolver person. I still don't know everything and never will, but I know more than I did when I got my first 1911. Hang in there.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 22, 2021 9:10 am 
Blackhawk

Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:28 pm
Posts: 733
Location: New Hampshire,"live free or die"
jgt, thanks for the reply! Yes that's exactly what I intend to do Shake it down with the original Colt magazine give it a good shake down Watch How I grip the gun and hold the gun to make sure it's not me. Been a long time since I shot this weapon. So that's a possibility. When going over the gun I did as you said to do with checking the slide stop with ammo in the magazine. I pretty much explained it but I had to keep filing until finally where the ammo did not touch the slide stop tip was pretty much about the time it would not engage the follower-on the magazine. I believe the ammunition and I don't have a box right in front of me was Winchester xpt hollow points looking at them against regular Hardball where they contact the follow, they do look like they're a little fatter in that area then regular hard ball or other hollow-point ammunition so that doesn't help. But then again this gun did this with Full Metal Jacket hard ball! So I will give it a shake down and make sure it's not me. If all goes well I will shake down the next magazine which is the Chip McCormick 7 round and then his 8 around Power Plus. Again watching my grip and hold on the gun so I am not contacting that slide stop! Like I said really the pistol should be out of time because when that bullet is bumping that slide stop even if it is the slide is nowhere near where it can be locked back and by the time the slide gets there theoretically the bullet should have made its way all the way up in the magazine to the lips all ready and should be nowhere near that slide stop tip. Again this is thinking in my mind watching the gun how it works carefully when I was trying to fit the slide stop.. got a new Wilson slide stop fit as much as I dare. Don't want to have to get a 3ed one! I'll report back here after I shake it down pretty good hopefully this weekend. But the timing thing I'm talking about with how the gun operates how does that theory sound to you? A bullet is not getting stuck on the tip of the slide stop and hanging up there long enough for the slide to be fully rear enough for it to be locked. So it's either me the magazine or possibly inertia from recoil. I have shot that gun one handed as Loose as I dare hold it years ago just to see how it would function , it always function 100%!


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 23, 2021 4:53 am 
Buckeye

Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 11:51 am
Posts: 1341
I have read some of your post so I believe you know more than I do. But, both of us know the slide stop is engaged by the follower in the magazine in normal operation. The cartridge holds the follower down in the magazine far enough to keep the slide stop from engaging until the last one is stripped from the follower. So, something is causing the slide stop to become engaged.
One question I failed to ask was, how do the Chip McCormick magazines feed into the mag well? Is it a smooth insertion or do you have to push the mag release button in a little to help it go past enough to lock in place? If they have to be helped, I would look at the mag release and see if it is in need of some fitting for clearance. The thought behind this is that the magazine has clearance when it is first inserted, but may have some pressure from something that is not completely square to the required tolerance. As the magazine begin to empty it may become less rigid and is being pressed ever so slightly towards the slide stop. That clearance is so small it would not take much to reduce it to non-existent. I know this is far fetched, but something is causing the slide stop to engage before the magazine is empty. That has to be contact with a bullet in a cartridge, because the cartridge is holding the follower down in the magazine where it can not touch the slide stop at this point.
The only other thing I could think of that could cause such a sideways pressure would be a grip screw that sticks over into the mag well and exerts pressure on the magazine. I hope this helps as it is more like throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 23, 2021 11:25 am 
Blackhawk

Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:28 pm
Posts: 733
Location: New Hampshire,"live free or die"
Jgt, thank you for trying to help me! What you say it's definitely worth looking into. If I flip the mag in slow I can feel when I hit the mag catch on on the release button then it will stop, a little bump for my palm and it will pass it. When I ordered the slide stop from Wilson I also ordered a magazine release spring and hold down screw. Nothing was really wrong with my old one that I could tell that one does feel tighter but I had the issue with the old one as I have not shot the gun yet with this one in it. I will look at and the grip screw too. My mags do drop freely and after inserting into the gun empty with the slide open I can juggle it just a little bit oh, I feel as it should be! All mag seem to fit well. This may sound foolish but when I get to the range or I should say sand pit and try to shake the gun out better I will be particularly conscious of my grip at all times. It is possible that is me bumping the slide stop somehow! I will repost after I give that gun a good run! Thank you!


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2021 5:45 pm 
Hawkeye
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Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:08 am
Posts: 12191
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George . . . A few thoughts.

The . . only . . magazine for a 1911 that I have ever had problems with were CMC.
I have some that were $9.95 and some that cost a LOT more than that. The ONLY
1911 mag's I have ever had problems with were/are CMC. :shock:

With the ones I gave away, I put the same mag in three different guns.
SAME RESULTS. That told me that it was the mag and not the gun.

I suggest you go out and purchase two or three different brands of mag and try
all of them. If you get results like mine, you know where the problem is.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 03, 2021 8:34 am 
Blackhawk

Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:28 pm
Posts: 733
Location: New Hampshire,"live free or die"
Sorry guys, have not been able to get to the sand pit. things keep coming up! But yes that was the plan I have three original lightly-used Colt magazines in fact one is almost new, they are the six rounders! Plan was to give it a good workout with those three magazines any issues Mark the mag keep going with the other two no issues then move on to the Chip McCormick mags. Same procedure! Also have full size magazines from a government model that will work just fine in the offices they are of different brands I will go with them if need be just so I can have more of a selection of different brands of to function test a pistol! I decided to put a small dimple in the slide stop for the plunger to detent into! Very shallow but it does have a slight resistance! This may help also! We will see when I get down there I will post! Thank you! George


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 04, 2021 5:40 am 
Buckeye

Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 11:51 am
Posts: 1341
Thanks for the update. I had been looking for it just in case you found the culprit.


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