School me on the Birdshead Vaquero

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PinnedAndRecessed

Single-Sixer
Joined
Jun 2, 2006
Messages
141
Anybody got one? I'm looking at the 45 Colt caliber. I reload, so I can tailor the loads to comfort levels. I'd rather go hotter than milder, though.

It looks like an uncomfortable gun to shoot. Is it?

I saw on another thread a discussion about internal locks. Are they on all new Ruger revolvers? Does it really make a difference?

thanx
 

RGRacing

Bearcat
Joined
Aug 25, 2013
Messages
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Location
Minneapolis, MN
Pair_of_BH.jpg


Love mine - I wanted it and I shoot it well - Many don't like them - It just felt right.
Little finger wraps around the bottom. Shooting Cowboy loads are pleasant.

If my pic doesn't show up its because it is on a unsecured server.
You can right click and open in a new tab - worked for me.
 
Joined
Dec 5, 2011
Messages
524
Location
FL
The birdshead is my most comfortable and pleasurable gun to fire, and the 45Colt is my favorite cartridge. Here are a few pics. The two on the left in the first image with Jamaican Blue Mahoe grips are original Vaquero in 45Colt.





 

Luckyducker

Single-Sixer
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
199
Location
Ft. Morgan, CO
I am of the opinion that shooters with smaller hands get along with the birdhead grip. My hands are large enough that even the plow handle grips feel a little small and the birdshead is just terrible to me. I have an ugly Hogue monogrip on my 41mag blackhawk that feels just right to me, and is/was my handgun that I deer hunted with and I just didn't care what it looked like, as in function over fashion.
 
Joined
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Messages
524
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FL
I'd agree with Dennis that the birdshead can be uncomfortable, but it becomes very comfortable when you add thicker, palm-filling grip panels (see below). This repositions your knuckle away from the back of the trigger guard and inspires confidence dropping the hammer on warmer loads. I'm 6' 1" tall and hate the paper-thin factory grips but love thicker, custom grips to the point that I can comfortly shoot factory 44Mag loads through it. If you get a newer model in 45Colt (called the "New Vaquero") you'll be limited on pressure and will need to keep the loads soft. If you find an older (I think pre-2005) original Vaquero 45Colt, then you can load hot or mild. The difference is in the size of the cylinder and cylinder frame. If you find one, get some grips made for it to fill your hand and make it comfortable.

 

jdowney

Bearcat
Joined
Oct 7, 2009
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Location
Rural New Mexico
I like a big swell on the bottom and a taper up to flush with the frame. This one is a .357 that I bought right before ammo got scarce again. I've only shot .38 spc in it, but its a pleasure to shoot.

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Not sure I would like them so much with the current flavor of factory grips. Those come off as soon as I get something better worked up.

I have large hands, but skinny fingers. I've never found a sixgun I didn't like shooting! :mrgreen:
 

PinnedAndRecessed

Single-Sixer
Joined
Jun 2, 2006
Messages
141
seasterl said:
If you get a newer model in 45Colt (called the "New Vaquero") you'll be limited on pressure and will need to keep the loads soft. If you find an older (I think pre-2005) original Vaquero 45Colt, then you can load hot or mild.

That's just the Vaquero line? Is it just the Birds Head Vaquero? Or are all Vaqueros similarly limited?

Also, would the New Model Blackhawks be similarly limited on pressures for the 45 Colt?
 
Joined
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Messages
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PinnedAndRecessed said:
seasterl said:
If you get a newer model in 45Colt (called the "New Vaquero") you'll be limited on pressure and will need to keep the loads soft. If you find an older (I think pre-2005) original Vaquero 45Colt, then you can load hot or mild.

That's just the Vaquero line? Is it just the Birds Head Vaquero? Or are all Vaqueros similarly limited?

Also, would the New Model Blackhawks be similarly limited on pressures for the 45 Colt?

It's primarily an issue because of a large-bore cartridge in a scaled-down, smaller-diameter cylinder (referring to 45Colt in all "New Vaquero" models). If you want to load "Ruger-only" 45Colt loads in a Vaquero, then you'll want to purchase one of the original "Vaquero" models. They show up on GunBroker all the time. It's not an issue with other cartridges like the 44Mag because there's still ample steel surrounding the chamber. Don't forget about the 45ACP. Mine shoots cheap, bulk factory ammo accurately in my birdshead.

Honestly speaking, though, limiting your 45Colt loads to only 14,000psi in a "New Vaquero" is still a very enjoyable time shooting in the birdshead and I doubt you'll want to shoot anything higher pressure. The New Vaquero also comes with the wide-spur hammer commonly found on Super Blackhawks. If you ever want to determine if a Ruger is rated low or for Ruger-only book loads, measure the diameter of the cylinder. They'll come in two diameters. My New Model Blackhawk has the bigger cylinder and can shoot the heavier loads. You might check out the black Wiley Clapp model. It "might" have the bigger cylinder. I'm sure someone here can verify. Below is my Blackhawk in 45Colt with warm 300gr Cast Performance LFNGC. These will wake you up!… I don't fire them very often!



… and here's the same gun with a 45ACP cylinder:

 
Joined
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Messages
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freakindawgen said:
seasterl, where did you get a unflutted 45 colt cylinder without a roll mark?

I bought it from a fellow forum member on this site. I bought another one just like it in 44Mag, but only the 45Colt cylinder fit a couple of my guns. If he's still around, maybe he'll chime and and mention where he got it.

I was pretty fortunate that the fluted 45ACP fit a couple of my guns (had to shim it, though). It's frustrating to finally find a cylinder and then won't fit any of your guns. In hindsight, I probably would have opted for the "convertible" model when possible.

For the benefit of the original poster, JDowney made my birdshead grips shown above (except for the yellow ones). The non-tapered, palm-filing thickness was done at my request, but you can see John's in his photo that have more taper at the top. I think those (with his taper) have more of a factory look and absolutely are better made in fit, finish, ergonomics, comfort, and control compared to the thin factory grips. Personal hand size will determine that. I thought about more taper, but the control and groups I was getting dictated I retain the non-tapered panels for my personal needs. With factory grips, I wanted my birdsheads to be my favorite revolvers, but John helped my dream to come to fruition. He's a humble guy and may not want me bragging on him like this, but as a messsage to the original poster, I'd say look for a well-cared-for original Vaquero in 45Colt, get a competent local gunsmith to tune it up, if desired, and help you regulate the front sight, if necessary, then get John (or one of the guys on this forum) to make a set of grips that fit YOUR HAND and you'll never regret it. It'll be the kind of gun you'll probably never sell. (Thanks, JDowney, for making my grips!)
 

contender

Ruger Guru
Joined
Sep 18, 2002
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25,142
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Lake Lure NC USA
When I teach,, I teach the concept of "Fit & Comfort" when it comes to a handgun. Every person has a different sized hand, and as such,, what might work for person "A" my be very wrong for person "B". Only you as an individual decide if what you seek will work as you wish. the best advice would be to try & find someone with a gun you seek, and fire it to see if it works for you.

That said,, I have all the different frame sized Rugers. Yes,, all of them. And in general,, a majority of people prefer a Bisley grip frame design for heavier recoil,, while the Birdshead design is often more comfortable for softer recoiling handguns. THIS IS NOT CAST IN STONE,, just an observation from allowing different folks to fire different handguns. The plow handle design is a good middle ground design that fits a lot of folks.
Custom grips can make a huge difference as well.

Again,, "fit & comfort."
 

BloodyThumb

Bearcat
Joined
Jun 5, 2003
Messages
59
I have a stainless 3" in 45acp from Talo, and one of the recent "Carry Hawk" ACP/LC dual cylinders.

I use them when hiking and find that when I carry crossdraw (due to a rifle, or a pack, or both, taking up space on my strong side) that the birds head grip shape is a lot more comfortable seated, bending over, and just in general when being active.

My only con is that the slick micarta grip panels that came on both has a tendency to slip in recoil if my hands are even the slightest bit wet from anything including just a little sweat. I picked up some nice checkered ones online for the Carry Hawk and it was such an improvement I am considering taking the micarta off the TALO and having a knife maker I know checker them for me. Also considering laser etched checkering as it is less expensive, but also not quite as sharp and real checkering.
 

princeout

Blackhawk
Joined
Jun 12, 2009
Messages
946
Location
Oklahoma
Idatpwo.jpg


Ruger birdshead grips.

500 Linebaugh by Gallagher, Bisley hammer, scalloped frame and no ejector rod or housing

45 Colt, original full sized Vaquero with Bisley hammer, BP chamfer, internal trigger stop and free spin modification

32 H&R Magnum, Single Six with Bisley hammer, Bisley hammer, CCH by John Powers via Alan Harton and barrel shortened by Alan

All are fun to shoot. The Gallagher is more palatable using Trail Boss but still manageable using H110. Shooting glove recommended.

uFp1akK.jpg


I forgot the glove - once.
 
Joined
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Messages
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Will the ERH not stay on with the 500 and was left off? Nice Bisley hammers, but is that what drew blood since they come down so low? Is the 45Colt a five-shot or six?
 

princeout

Blackhawk
Joined
Jun 12, 2009
Messages
946
Location
Oklahoma
seasterl said:
Will the ERH not stay on with the 500 and was left off? Nice Bisley hammers, but is that what drew blood since they come down so low? Is the 45Colt a five-shot or six?

The ERH and ejector rod were removed intentionally. Along with scalloping the frame and recoil shield, it was done to lighten the gun. It was built for a friend of John's for bear protection while fishing in Alaska - if my memory is correct. It had a holster by Ringler with a short rod for punching out the empty brass. I didn't end up with the holster or rod - wish I could get the set back together.

The skin was broken by a not quite tight enough grip and a hot load causing the gun to want to roll. Something had to give and the skin on my thumb lost.

The 45 is a factory six shot.

Tim
 

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