How to make a Mini30 shoot surplus
- Thread starter SHOOTER
- Start date
Help Support Ruger Forum:
SHOOTER said:
Cannot answer your question, but am interested in the round in the new #1 edition, is bulk that white box stuff I see on the web? Is Wolf steel case considered to be quality ammo or similar to the stuff your using with problems? I'm looking at a case of 1000 for $230.
This problem is why I've never bought a Mini30. I've read a lot about them and asked the same question but never got an answer that seemed to ensure I wouldn't have to buy expensive brass cased ammo. MAK-90's digest anything.
I'm not sure about this but something is making me think the stronger spring created another problem ..... maybe with the firing pin itself. (??) I hope someone with better memory chimes in for you shortly.
SHOOTER said:
Yep, that sounds familiar. My experience was that for every 10 guys who said they own a Mini30, maybe 1 or 2 say theirs shoots commie ammo okay. Seems like you either get one that will do it ..... or not. Dang the SAAMI specs! :lol:
This topic surfaces every couple of months. The Berdan primers on commie ammo is borderline-ignitable on Mini's. Some Mini's will shoot it, some will not. Stronger mainsprings could make the difference, but it's then reported that firing pins break. Even if they don't break, is the heavier spring gonna puncture the primers on softer domestic primers? This discussion will never end.
A couple recent links...
http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=216814&p=2167855&hilit=PPU#p2167855
http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=226417&p=2272465&hilit=mini+30#p2272465
WAYNO.
A couple recent links...
http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=216814&p=2167855&hilit=PPU#p2167855
http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=226417&p=2272465&hilit=mini+30#p2272465
WAYNO.
Me thinks that there may be more than one thing in play relative to why one Mini-30 functions well with steel-cased European ammo but another doesn't.
1)....There is a difference in a SAAMI-spec 7.62X39 chamber and a CIP-spec 7.62X39 chamber. Given that, I'd have to assume that USA-made ammo is sized slightly different than European-made ammo....which in turn, suggest that the differences in the two will result in slightly different head spacing when used in a given rifle.
2).... By design, the "tail" of the Mini-30 firing pin can not move forward when struck by the hammer unless the bolt is fully closed, which may not happen if one's ammo doesn't fully seat into one's chamber. On the other end of that mule, if the ammo sits a hair too low, the firing-pin dent will be corrospondingly too shallow.
3).,,, It has been well-documented that Ruger's manufacturing QC often aint what it should be. What that means to this discussion is that the bolt face of some Mini-30's have been found to have what looks like a "volcano shape" of displaced metal surrounding the firing pin hole which should have been removed during manufacture but was not. The effect of that is...it's a given that any amount of displaced metal will hold the cartridge away from the bolt face, so everhow "tall" that "volcano" is is exactly how much firing pin protrusion is missing relative to how much is available to hit the primer.
4)....If 1-3 above aint enough to chew on, there's also this:
Repotedly, Ruger uses some sort of "one off" chamber reamer for their 7.62X39 rifles which they loosely copied from a propiretary Lapua(sp?) design, which itself was slightly different form the European CIP standard. That was suppossedly done in order to keep the chamber pressure within the "SAAMI ball park" back when they was marketing .308 barreled rifles for use with .310-.312 ammo.
To me, what all this suggest is......
1)....There's reasons why Ruger only recomends ammo that is made to US specs.
2)....Like it or not, the Ruger Mini is not a precision-made rifle to start with, and a brass cartidge case can be forced into a slightly "out of whack" chamber much easier than can a much-stiffer steel cartridge case. Me thinks that's why brass CIP ammo works perfectly fine in a Mini-30 when steel CIP ammo won't.
3)....If simply switching to a stronger hammer spring would have "fixed" the "steel ammo in the Mini-30 problem" without it leading to other problems, Ruger would have done so years ago.
Hope this helps.
DGW
1)....There is a difference in a SAAMI-spec 7.62X39 chamber and a CIP-spec 7.62X39 chamber. Given that, I'd have to assume that USA-made ammo is sized slightly different than European-made ammo....which in turn, suggest that the differences in the two will result in slightly different head spacing when used in a given rifle.
2).... By design, the "tail" of the Mini-30 firing pin can not move forward when struck by the hammer unless the bolt is fully closed, which may not happen if one's ammo doesn't fully seat into one's chamber. On the other end of that mule, if the ammo sits a hair too low, the firing-pin dent will be corrospondingly too shallow.
3).,,, It has been well-documented that Ruger's manufacturing QC often aint what it should be. What that means to this discussion is that the bolt face of some Mini-30's have been found to have what looks like a "volcano shape" of displaced metal surrounding the firing pin hole which should have been removed during manufacture but was not. The effect of that is...it's a given that any amount of displaced metal will hold the cartridge away from the bolt face, so everhow "tall" that "volcano" is is exactly how much firing pin protrusion is missing relative to how much is available to hit the primer.
4)....If 1-3 above aint enough to chew on, there's also this:
Repotedly, Ruger uses some sort of "one off" chamber reamer for their 7.62X39 rifles which they loosely copied from a propiretary Lapua(sp?) design, which itself was slightly different form the European CIP standard. That was suppossedly done in order to keep the chamber pressure within the "SAAMI ball park" back when they was marketing .308 barreled rifles for use with .310-.312 ammo.
To me, what all this suggest is......
1)....There's reasons why Ruger only recomends ammo that is made to US specs.
2)....Like it or not, the Ruger Mini is not a precision-made rifle to start with, and a brass cartidge case can be forced into a slightly "out of whack" chamber much easier than can a much-stiffer steel cartridge case. Me thinks that's why brass CIP ammo works perfectly fine in a Mini-30 when steel CIP ammo won't.
3)....If simply switching to a stronger hammer spring would have "fixed" the "steel ammo in the Mini-30 problem" without it leading to other problems, Ruger would have done so years ago.
Hope this helps.
DGW
hittman said:
My solution would be to buy better ammo. Never could figure out why someone would buy a high quality American made rifle and then shoot cheap 3rd world crap out of it.
Best way to get rid of that ammo is buy an SKS or AK-47.
Robes
Single-Sixer
I have a Mini-30 and it doesn't like Russian ammo at all. Not only misfires, but bullets get stuck in the barrel. I got out the micrometer and the Russian stuff is way out of spec....both bullets and casings. I also have a PA-63 that is chambered in the Makarov round that came with Russian bear ammo. Big problem with the hard primers. If I use PPU, Fiocchi or PMC, no problem.
I just have this cardinal rule about ammo for all my firearms, no steel,... only brass and I stay away from the Russian stuff....
BTW,... the Mini-30 is an GREAT gun.....
steelshooterco
Single-Sixer
Send it back to Ruger and explain the issue. Take 3-4 of the rounds with the light primer strike that did not ignite, pull the bullets and dump the powder, send primed cases in with the rifle to Ruger, and also advise the brad, lot, and bullet weight of the ammo.
Call them an tell them you have a defective gun and ask for a call tag.
See what happens, worst thing is they will tell you to use other ammo, maybe they have a better (more powerful) spring they can add, and its all still under warranty and they'll test fire it for you.
You could ask if they want some of the ammo as well and you could send that in separately but under the same return number they give you.
That's what I'd do.
Call them an tell them you have a defective gun and ask for a call tag.
See what happens, worst thing is they will tell you to use other ammo, maybe they have a better (more powerful) spring they can add, and its all still under warranty and they'll test fire it for you.
You could ask if they want some of the ammo as well and you could send that in separately but under the same return number they give you.
That's what I'd do.
......SHOOTER said:
If the bolt face on your particular rifle exhibits such a defect, sure it will help. It might not stop the misfires completely, but at least you'll know that all of the available firing-pin travel is getting to the primer.
Bear in mind though, that ya don't want to remove metal from the bolt face itself, so be carefull to only remove the offending area of displacement. Otherwise, you'll be tampering with the rifle's headspace.
DGW
Voyager28
Single-Sixer
blume357 said:
DING, DING, DING! We have a winner, Johnny!
Exactly what he said.
Bob
PriseDeFer
Single-Sixer
- Joined
- Apr 22, 2014
- Messages
- 450
The concept of a rifle chambered for a Russian cartridge that cannot function with Russian cartridges seems an unfortunate manifestation of an odd elitism. Whatever, they lost and are losing a lot of sales by leaving a significant part of the market to former ComBloc exporters.
