Super Red Hawk Talo 10mm Auto

The Norseman · May 9, 2020

See one of our Gun Dealers has a new Ruger Super Redhawk in
10mm Auto and it is a Talo Exclusive model.

Didn't realize such a Ruger Revolver existed. I believe the $715
& Tax is a good price.

Been interested in the 10mm Auto, since Smith & Wesson reintroduced
the Model 610 again. They're a very nice Revolver too.

contender · May 10, 2020

The 10mm is sorta like the .41 mag. Many folks like them,, and enjoy them,, but the majority of folks prefer "other" calibers. But they have enough of a following to where manufacturers are still making them,, and that's a good thing.

needsmostuff · May 10, 2020

10MM,,,,, When they put a rim on it they will have something.

contender · May 10, 2020

"10MM,,,,, When they put a rim on it they will have something."

Uhh,, try the .41 magnum.

Sugar River · May 11, 2020

contender said:
"10MM,,,,, When they put a rim on it they will have something."

Uhh,, try the .41 magnum.

Contender beat me to it.

needsmostuff · May 11, 2020

contender said:
"10MM,,,,, When they put a rim on it they will have something."

Uhh,, try the .41 magnum.

Uhhhhh, My comment was not made as lightly as it sounds or as dismissively as your responses .
So , to spell it out.
I have 41 mags ,,,, and 41 GNR guns so I have plenty of .411 to work with.
I also have a 401 Powermag (which is very close to a rimmed 10mm) which I feel has an appropriate diameter difference (.401) from a 44mag ( actually a 43 mag ) to bring something to the table.
But 401 powermag only came in German made single actions ,has brass supply , die support issues and died on the vine and makes it a tough one to work with.
In many cases 41 mag is mostly a 44 mag lite. That may anger the faithful but a rimmed 40 cal. would cut a better middle ground between .357 and 44 mag. .357 -.401 - .429. as opposed to .357 - .411- .429.
Yeah , 10 mm is getting there but,,, I'm not a huge fan of revolvers requiring moonclips . Sure they are the current darling of the shoot fast crowd but the possibilty of iffy headspacing is always there . 45 ACP in a revolver , fine , 45 Auto Rim in a revolver , better. I am a fan of RIMS in revolvers with hard hitting magnums. 10 mms as built should stay in semi autos, they work well there.

From where I stand , if 10mm grew a rim it could be spectacular ,,,,,,,,,not just kind of cool.

contender · May 11, 2020

Ok, I apologize for my reply sounding dismissive.

I was thinking of the history of the "40 cal's" in general.
The .41 mag was developed as "the ultimate police caliber," back when revolvers were standard issue firearms for LE. It was more powerful than the .357 and not as heavy recoiling as the .44 mag.
Then along came the "wonder-9" 9mm as well as many LE agencies switching to semi-auto designs. Many felt the 9mm was not the best caliber for LE work, and many also felt the .45 was "outdated." So,, the 10mm was developed as a semi-auto caliber for LE work,, to do the same as the .41 mag. But it too was pushed by the wayside,, about the same way the .41 mag got shunned by many in LE work. So,, along came the .40 S&W which is a shortened .10mm,, and it got accepted by many LE departments,, as THE caliber to have AND it was in their preferred types of firearms,,, the semi-autos.
Sadly,, budgets,, and expenses,, (along with recoil sensitive non-gun types who failed qualifications a lot) have made many LE departments go back to the 9mm,, thinking it'll be "ok." They fail to heed the lessons of history.
But in the recent years,, the gently demanding public has wanted more 10mm handguns,, and with the increase in demands,, more companies are now building 10mm handguns. And a FEW companies do chamber revolvers in 10mm to satisfy the desires of many who wish for a companion revolver to their semi's.

Now,, I know you most likely already know most of this,, by the fact you seem to enjoy the "40 cals" in general. But I seriously doubt that modern times will provide enough demand for a rimmed 10mm. Thank the newer generation of gun owners who think revolvers are "outdated."

BTW; I have some .401 brass & such,,,, just no gun in that caliber.

tulsamal · May 12, 2020

The .41 mag was developed as "the ultimate police caliber," back when revolvers were standard issue firearms for LE. It was more powerful than the .357 and not as heavy recoiling as the .44 mag.

That's true... but LE was supposed to use the M58 and a reduced velocity police load. The M58 was setup like your typical M&P... just bigger and heavier. With the midrange lead bullet load, it would have been fine. With 210 grain JSP's designed for max energy and hunting... wasn't right at all.

And that's the bullet/load side. The gun side was also a problem. I have an M58 and two M57's... they are big heavy N frames. Of course there was no L frame back then. The K frame was too small for the big bullets, the N was too large and heavy for all day belt carry for most LE types. If there had been a 581 size gun and .41 Special... that might have won the day.

tulsamal · May 12, 2020

Sadly,, budgets,, and expenses,, (along with recoil sensitive non-gun types who failed qualifications a lot) have made many LE departments go back to the 9mm,, thinking it'll be "ok." They fail to heed the lessons of history.

I totally disagree with that. The problems with 9mm were ammo problems. I personally carry a .357 SIG just because that's me. But if I had to carry a 9mm and I had modern Gold Dot bonded bullet HP's... that is giving up nothing. A modern 9mm Gold Dot load is actually a better "man stopper" than the original midrange .41 Magnum load. Every day, every time. I love my big old N frames... but any and every cop would be better off with a Glock 17 and Gold Dots rather than a S&W M58 with the original lead bullet cop load. That's without even factoring in the massive difference in capacity or which one is easier to shoot well.

Gregg

needsmostuff · May 12, 2020

needsmostuff said:
contender said:

I was thinking of the history of the "40 cal's" in general.

Click to expand...

Your history is complete with a couple of minor omissions. :lol:

The whole 40 thing started with the vision of George Herter of catalog fame who saw the need to split the difference between .357 and .429.
His brain child was the 401 Power Mag . He did the legwork getting the ammo ,dies and guns made and on the market. Not only the large Single Action still seen today but also reputedly a funky R.G. looking double action , which thankfully is never seen.
After all that was up and running S&W launched the 41 mag and just blew him out of the water . That was the end of the 401 . The cartridge competed toe to toe with the 41 mag but the guns never competed with the S&W offerings.
Lastly , a minor squabble .
While the 41 mag is often compared to the 40 cal's. it cannot be part of the 40 cal. history .
Cuz it's not a 40 cal.

I do agree that a rimmed version will never appear due to lack of demand.
But going back to the OP looking at a Super Redhawk in 10mm. Think what a magnificent beast it could be if rimmed ,,,,,, or even if the forgotten 10mm MAG was rimmed and used. Hummmmmmmmmm. Now that could be a flat shooting , hard hitting , hunting gun.

Ale-8(1) · May 12, 2020

contender said:
The .41 mag was developed as "the ultimate police caliber," back when revolvers were standard issue firearms for LE. It was more powerful than the .357 and not as heavy recoiling as the .44 mag.

Yep, the .41 was born out of the efforts of Skeeter Skelton, Bill Jordan, and (I think) Elmer Keith, looking for that "middle of the road" round for police use.

While it's not a true .40/10mm, it played a significant influence on the development of the so-called "middle magnum" even though the ammo makers tended to make it "more magnum" and "less middle". As such, we include it in the discussions of these developments simply as a background info. One could include the .38-40 in the discussion, even though it was a weakling when compared to the most recent 10mm developments. JMHO YMMV :mrgreen:

contender · May 13, 2020

"I totally disagree with that."

I base my comments about the 9mm in LE work upon discussions with several LE agencies Chiefs or Sheriffs. My son is LEO, my best friend is retired Federal, and was a firearms instructor, along with the many Sheriffs & such I have known or do know.
Budgets,, as well as the training officers seeing "desk jockies" fail qualifications, all have contributed to the adoption of the 9mm as the issue caliber.
I fully agree that the 9mm ammo has improved & come a long way in recent years. But when you study the 1986 Miami shooting where federal officers died because of the 9mm failing to stop the 2 thugs,, you also see the reason the .40 cals were adopted afterwards.

And Ale-8(1) is right. It was Skeeter, Bill & a few others who championed the .41 mag as the best police caliber. But again, a heavy gun, that is carried a lot, but shot very little by most LEO's created it's own issues & wasn't widely accepted. Skeeter & Bill were involved in more than a few shootings & saw the needs,,,,,,,,,,,!

Fun discussion!

Kevin · May 13, 2020

Wow! This is a great thread. I don't have a 10mm, or a 40 cal. but do enjoy the 41 Mag. It's nice to know the historical development of different calibers and how they came about.

rangerbob · May 13, 2020

Having been in LE from 1974 to 2003 as a State Trooper and since then working for the DA's office as their FA instructor, amongst other duties, I have to add my 2 cents worth. The FBI Miami shootout biggest problem was tactics. You don't bring revolvers to a rifle shoot, particularly when the rifle shooters are known killers. Why were the MP-5's, M-16's and bullets vests still at the office instead of the agent's hands? The only long gun present was an 870 shotgun, which was, eventually put to good use. One agent was only armed with a J frame 5 shot. AS pointed out, the 9mm failed to do the job, and the FBI sought out the 10mm 1076 S&W pistol as a replacement, which worked fine for the few agents that could shoot it. For those that don't know, the FBI released a report in late 2014 that stated, according to their testing and after action reports from Doctors, the 9mm with the best loads, ie Gold Dot, Critical Duty, etc, performed as well as the 45 or 40 with their best loads. The 357 Sig and 10mm were not mentioned. The main push back to 9mm for most agencies were the lower cost of 9mm ammo and the better chance of training non gun recruits to qualify. Having a 1/2 box of ammo in your gun doesn't count if you can't hit anything. I'm, of course, a huge fan of the 10mm, 357 Sig, and the 41 magnum. Had S&W introduced the M58 as a L-frame 41 Special things would have been different. I have a 10mm GP-100 MC in 10mm, but would prefer the same gun in 41 Special. If you have a 10mm, enjoy it. Bob! 8)

Sugar River · May 13, 2020

I'll leave this here for Bob.

rangerbob · May 14, 2020

SR, don't tell me that's a 41 Special GP-100! Bob!!

Sugar River · May 14, 2020

Your eyes don't lie!
All it takes is money.

rangerbob · May 15, 2020

SR, if you don't mind telling, who did the work? Bob! :?:

Sugar River · May 15, 2020

Dave Clements. He listed a 10mm conversion for GPs and 686s. I asked if he could do it in
.41 Spec. No problemo.

Ale-8(1) · May 16, 2020

contender said:
And Ale-8(1) is right. It was Skeeter, Bill & a few others who championed the .41 mag as the best police caliber. But again, a heavy gun, that is carried a lot, but shot very little by most LEO's created it's own issues & wasn't widely accepted. Skeeter & Bill were involved in more than a few shootings & saw the needs,,,,,,,,,,,!

Ty, we haven't yet totally lost all our memories. In Payton Miller's article on the .41 Magnum S&W Models 57 and 58 in my just-arrived July issue of SHOOTING TIMES, we find this in the opening paragraph:

"Elmer Keith, Bill Jordan, and Skeeter Skelton all had a hand in convincing Smith and Wesson (along with ammomakers Remington and Norma) to join forces on the .41 project back in 1963."

I really miss those guys.

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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