22 mag handgun bandwagon

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mongochicago

Bearcat
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Jan 18, 2014
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I am a 22 mag fan. Kel Tech has the PMR30. Had one, too ammo fussy. Got rid of it. Armscor is coming out with one on a 1911 frame and a Beretta type slide. Hoping it functions better when I get it. Would anyone else be interested in Ruger producing a 22 mag semi auto handgun? As fussy as Kel Techs can be, they still can't keep up with demand, so there seems to be a market for it.
 

GunnyGene

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I think the Armscor is not a .22 mag semi auto, but fires the new .22 TCM which is a necked down 9mm center fire cartridge, not a rimfire. But yes, I'd like to see a .22wmr SA pistol other than the PMR, if they can solve the problems with it.
 

djw54

Single-Sixer
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It's definitely confusing. Armscor calls it the XT 22 Magnum, but then says it's 22TCM9R (see the press release on their website posted llast week).
 

GunnyGene

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djw54 said:
It's definitely confusing. Armscor calls it the XT 22 Magnum, but then says it's 22TCM9R (see the press release on their website posted llast week).

Imho, many of the problems with .22 is a result of the rimfire primer. With the level of manufacturing technology available today, I don't see any technical reason why a .22 could not have an integral center fire primer. Not a replaceable/reloadable cartridge, but a single use centerfire cartridge. Granted there are a great many rimfire firearms out there, but it would be an option that would catch on I think, and retrofitting a rimfire mechanism with a centerfire capability would be relatively simple, imho.

Has there been anyone in the ammo industry that has explored this?
 

djw54

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GunnyGene said:
djw54 said:
It's definitely confusing. Armscor calls it the XT 22 Magnum, but then says it's 22TCM9R (see the press release on their website posted llast week).

Imho, many of the problems with .22 is a result of the rimfire primer. With the level of manufacturing technology available today, I don't see any technical reason why a .22 could not have an integral center fire primer. Not a replaceable/reloadable cartridge, but a single use centerfire cartridge. Granted there are a great many rimfire firearms out there, but it would be an option that would catch on I think, and retrofitting a rimfire mechanism with a centerfire capability would be relatively simple, imho.

Has there been anyone in the ammo industry that has explored this?

I would have to imagine that it's been considered, but it may be a simple matter of size limiting what you can do with a centerfire primer; there's just no room for one in the current rimfire cases. Oh, wait, you're saying integrate it into the current case...I don't know what complications that would present. I would think there's still a space problem, if not for the components of the primer, then for the tooling to assemble the thing.
 

mongochicago

Bearcat
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Jan 18, 2014
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I just e-mailed Armscor to clarify which cartridge it actually is. The item number is 51996 and I am sure its the rimfire version, but will know positively when they e-mail me back.
 

GunnyGene

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djw54 said:
GunnyGene said:
djw54 said:
It's definitely confusing. Armscor calls it the XT 22 Magnum, but then says it's 22TCM9R (see the press release on their website posted llast week).

Imho, many of the problems with .22 is a result of the rimfire primer. With the level of manufacturing technology available today, I don't see any technical reason why a .22 could not have an integral center fire primer. Not a replaceable/reloadable cartridge, but a single use centerfire cartridge. Granted there are a great many rimfire firearms out there, but it would be an option that would catch on I think, and retrofitting a rimfire mechanism with a centerfire capability would be relatively simple, imho.

Has there been anyone in the ammo industry that has explored this?

I would have to imagine that it's been considered, but it may be a simple matter of size limiting what you can do with a centerfire primer; there's just no room for one in the current rimfire cases. Oh, wait, you're saying integrate it into the current case...I don't know what complications that would present. I would think there's still a space problem, if not for the components of the primer, then for the tooling to assemble the thing.

Correct. The current primer chemicals in a rf case are injected in liquid form and the case spun to force it into the rim cavity where it dries. Pretty simple, and should be adaptable to a similar process for a center fire construction, where the case metal can be stamped thin enough during case manufacturing to be compressed by a firing pin.
 

mongochicago

Bearcat
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The Armscor XT 22 Mag #51996 IS A RIMFIRE! Just got the e-mail from Armscor. I anxiously await its release.
 

djw54

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mongochicago said:
The Armscor XT 22 Mag #51996 IS A RIMFIRE! Just got the e-mail from Armscor. I anxiously await its release.

Excellent! Makes sense, as they already have a 1911 in the 22 TCM.
 

GunnyGene

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mongochicago said:
The Armscor XT 22 Mag #51996 IS A RIMFIRE! Just got the e-mail from Armscor. I anxiously await its release.

Well they might release it this year. They've been promising this since 2012. 15+1 double stack mag. They also slapped on a funky rail on top of the barrel to accomodate some weird optics. Since it's a full size 1911 sorta, it wouldn't appeal to folks who want a summer carry gun in .22mag (a compact), which is what I was hoping for. I already have a Sig 1911-.22lr, which is a good fun plinker and a LCR.22mag for summer carry, but if I'm going to carry a full size 1911 style, I want full size ammo. :)

Plus it's expensive, about $600 plus tax, etc.

I'll have to pass on this.

http://www.guns.com/2015/01/28/rock-island-armorys-hot-new-lineup-for-2015-video/
 
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I miss my AMT Automag .22 mag, but I miss my Ruger KMK678GC (slab side stainless MK2 target) too, even though it was a complete impossible mess to reassemble after field strip and clean.
 

djw54

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Here's a video of Jeff Quinn shooting the Armscor 22 magnum 1911 and the "mini" 380 1911 at the SHOT show range day: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9d3Z3dDnXrk

The Armscor footage is in the first 2:20 or so of the video. Stay until the end of the Armscor footage to see fairly close views of the 22mag and the 380.
 

Cheesewhiz

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GunnyGene said:
I think the Armscor is not a .22 mag semi auto, but fires the new .22 TCM which is a necked down 9mm center fire cartridge, not a rimfire.

That's what I thought also; that the .22TCM was a necked down 9mm. It's not, it's a shortened and re-necked .223/5.56 case.
 

GunnyGene

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Cheesewhiz said:
GunnyGene said:
I think the Armscor is not a .22 mag semi auto, but fires the new .22 TCM which is a necked down 9mm center fire cartridge, not a rimfire.

That's what I thought also; that the .22TCM was a necked down 9mm. It's not, it's a shortened and re-necked .223/5.56 case.

Ok. I thought I read on their site that you could swap out the .22mag barrel for a 9mm, but I reckon I misunderstood. :)
 

Cheesewhiz

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GunnyGene said:
Cheesewhiz said:
GunnyGene said:
I think the Armscor is not a .22 mag semi auto, but fires the new .22 TCM which is a necked down 9mm center fire cartridge, not a rimfire.

That's what I thought also; that the .22TCM was a necked down 9mm. It's not, it's a shortened and re-necked .223/5.56 case.

Ok. I thought I read on their site that you could swap out the .22mag barrel for a 9mm, but I reckon I misunderstood. :)

My friend owns a double stack version of this gun. It does come with a 9mm barrel, the case rim is close enough on both cartridges to function in the same slide without changing the extractor or the ejector on the frame.

....and the magazines will work with both rounds.
 

djw54

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GunnyGene said:
Cheesewhiz said:
GunnyGene said:
I think the Armscor is not a .22 mag semi auto, but fires the new .22 TCM which is a necked down 9mm center fire cartridge, not a rimfire.

That's what I thought also; that the .22TCM was a necked down 9mm. It's not, it's a shortened and re-necked .223/5.56 case.

Ok. I thought I read on their site that you could swap out the .22mag barrel for a 9mm, but I reckon I misunderstood. :)

You are talking about two different guns. Rock Island does have a 9/22TCM model, and now apparently also has the XT 22 mag model.
 

planetcat

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I'd buy a nice lightweight semiauto pistol in .22 wmr, if Ruger made one. I love my lcr, but would prefer a higher capacity pistol. Something small, light, and compact.
 
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DA_TriggR4Ruger said:
I miss my AMT Automag .22 mag, but I miss my Ruger KMK678GC (slab side stainless MK2 target) too, even though it was a complete impossible mess to reassemble after field strip and clean.

Someone asked about this in another thread, but I can't seem to find the post, so I'll answer it here. The AMT Automag was a LOT easier to disassemble and "esp. reassemble" than the Ruger. I almost bought an AMT Lightning but it was the same gun as the MK series Ruger.

I agree, yes, there are plenty of quality .22 target pistols out there. Everybody just has to find what they are comfortable with.

I'm getting back into .22 pistol target shooting and will post anything I can that you may find helpful.
 
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