Cop looking for new duty weapon

I am not a biased Fanboi. I own all of the weapons involved in this discussion. If the OP is considering a P89DC after carrying a Ruger P94 for 18 years....there is a reason for that. Yes, a Sig is the same DC only operating system but the OP found a P89DC for $199. If my math serves me correctly he could buy 3 at that price for the price of one Sig 229. No Fanboi here. I'm just trying to use reading comprehension to help the OP make a decision. A decision that sounds like it is being influenced by cost. Again, I could be wrong, but it sounds like he is purchasing his own duty weapon.

Saying that a Sig is unequaled in quality and accuracy is fairly broad when speaking of Sigs made recently. As an FFL dealer that has moved over 10,000 guns through an A&D....I have seen quality and lack of quality based on those numbers. Some read that a Sig is what the "seals" use and therefore it is the best gun. A Sig that you can buy at the local gun store is not a "Seal" gun. "Seal" guns are vetted, and there are those that have been rejected due to ISSUES. Or, its their duty weapon and has been for years and they love the Sig. Great. I know officers that do not even shoot except to qualify. They are far from being a beta tester by simply walking around with a holstered weapon.

If you want a Glock....buy one. Then....shoot it until it proves reliable and you can make hits with it. Same goes for Sig, S&W, H&K, FN, and even...gasp....a Ruger. Rev seems to forget that some local, state and federal departments have all fielded Ruger P series pistols either in the past or currently. Are they all the current rage? NO. Glocks are. Some use Sigs. Some use M&P's. There are many differences from one agency to the next. 40 years ago, no SA pistol was used by the majority. Times change.

Rev still won't address the question that I have asked him for month. He likes to spout that anyone who thinks a Ruger P series worth a damn doesn't know what they are talking about, cant shoot, etc. So Rev again.......Do you think Massad Ayoob can outshoot a P series Ruger?

http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2008/05/31/picking-your-gun/

Instead of attempting...and failing to insult me, why don't you answer my question. Is it because it goes against every thing you have EVER wrote here? Or is it beneath you in all of your wisdom? Do you think Massad knows anything about the subject? Enlighten me.

Massad Ayoob ? One guy who likes one or two old models of the one manufacturer's gun you constantly yammer on about ?

I respect most of Ayoob's thinking. Never seen him shoot though ... So I have no idea if he can or can't outshoot a given gun.

Question answered.

REV

revhigh said:

Massad Ayoob ? One guy who likes one or two old models of the one manufacturer's gun you constantly yammer on about ?

I respect most of Ayoob's thinking. Never seen him shoot though ... So I have no idea if he can or can't outshoot a given gun.

Question answered.

REV

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:lol: Good answer. I'll let others decide who's opinion to respect more. Revhigh the Ruger Forum moderator or.....Massad Ayoob. Google is your friend Rev. I'll go yammer on about something else for a while. :shock:

Good luck to the OP and his "choice" of a next duty weapon.

TRanger said:

DA_TriggR4Ruger said:

Most PDs utilize only Sigs and/or Glocks. [/quote

That's news to me. In addition to those brands, I've seen plenty of S&W, HK, Colt, Beretta, Springfield, and yes even Ruger pistols in duty holsters. Seeing an increase in the number of FN products as well nowadays.

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Depends on your definition of 'plenty' ...

I'd guess the 'majority' of LEO's probably use Glocks .... Mainly Because they're issued Glocks ... The rest are a mix of the other main known high quality brands ... Sig, HK, S&W, FN, Beretta, etc. it's pretty tough to find any department issued Rugers.

If anybody knows any departments that issue an SR Ruger variant ... Please list them.

I think one main reason not many PD's go with Rugers ... is Ruger's propensity for releasing guns that immediately have problems and recalls associated with them. Ayoob's beloved 345's probably had Rugers biggest and widest ranging failures ... That of the infamous click-no-bang syndrome caused by pulling the trigger on the gun when it had no mag in it. If that was ever done ... You then had no idea if or when the gun would fail ... Not exactly reassuring if your life depends on your firearm.

Don't believe me ? Google "P345 click no bang" ....

REV

Al James said:

I'll go yammer on about something else for a while.

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Everybody thanks you for that ....

REV

And 5% of everything else just fills the empty space in the pie chart of 35-40% of Glock and Sig.

A lot of forces are now using S&W M&P's, I hate the stock trigger on those guns, if the cops switch over to an Apex type trigger it would only make me more concerned as most cops shoot as well as I mine ore from the planet Mars.

Cheesewhiz said:

A lot of forces are now using S&W M&P's, I hate the stock trigger on those guns, if the cops switch over to an Apex type trigger it would only make me more concerned as most cops shoot as well as I mine ore from the planet Mars.

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Ain't that the sad truth. I know there are obvious exceptions, but it never ceases to amaze me how many LEOs never shoot except for required quals - and bellyache and sweat those when they come up. Granted, most LEOs will go an entire career without an OIS but, still, it blows my mind how little interest some of them have in that chunk of iron (okay, plastic, these days, for most of them) hanging on their belt all those hours. Years ago we leased the "old range" that was next to a municipal PD range for our meets. We got to know the RM pretty well and he was always complaining that he wished a tenth of his officers could shoot half as well as our lower-scoring members. We offered to let the officers shoot with us any time they wanted and only had a couple of takers.

It's interesting that one of the recent obvious exceptions to the "cops can't shoot" rule was using an issued M&P http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/12/06/austin-cop-sure-shot-stopped-crazed-gunman/ (for what it's worth I hate the trigger on them, too). Granted, that was an exceptional shot and not likely that he could consistently repeat it...still, I kind of suspect he's not one of those LEOs that stuffs whatever the armorer issues him into a holster and never looks at it until the next mandatory qualification...

John

I don't know if this is any help but most departments around here use Glocks. Those that don't use Glocks use M&P's. Good Luck with your decision.

same here. Glocks across the board.

The only thing I've found locally are a p89dc and a p89dao for $209. The outsides are fair with some scratches and wear. The insides look low mileage except for some scratches on the bottom of the slide where it contacts the hammer. I can tell that neither has been cleaned or oiled in a long time.


I would love to find a nice p90 or p89 decocker but they seem scarce.

Those seem to both be good prices IMO. Last P89DC I sold was last week on Gunbroker. No box or paperwork with 1 mag....went for $350 buy it now. You could always go online and buy what you want and then have your FFL handle the transfer for you. Let us know what you end up buying.

Looking for a stainless P89 or P90 just in better condition

So why does it have to be a plastic gun what is wrong with a good old fashion Ruger service 6 in 357 mag ? the fuzz carried them for years and they worked just fine.

If you just have to have a black semi auto I'd go with a Sig P226 MK25 Navy Seal model, it's black stainless not plastic crap comes with 3-15 round mags. lot better gun than any Glock.

My first duty gun was a Ruger P89DC blued. I shot well with that gun and put trijicon night sights on and had it parkerized due to rust issues. I carried it for two years. I never had an issue with it. I moved on to various other pistols such as SIG and Glock once I made better money. I am now restricted to a SIG229R in .40 [ not my choice]I would say if you like the Ruger then get a P89DC and don't look back. I am not sure how the DAO P89 runs. I have been thinking about trying one out. Good luck in your search.

Maybe try the Smith & Wesson M&P 9 or M&P 40?

foilist said:

Maybe try the Smith & Wesson M&P 9 or M&P 40?

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Those are crap, they make a Glock look good.

cwm1150 said:

My first duty gun was a Ruger P89DC blued. I shot well with that gun and put trijicon night sights on and had it parkerized due to rust issues. I carried it for two years. I never had an issue with it. I moved on to various other pistols such as SIG and Glock once I made better money. I am now restricted to a SIG229R in .40 [ not my choice]I would say if you like the Ruger then get a P89DC and don't look back. I am not sure how the DAO P89 runs. I have been thinking about trying one out. Good luck in your search.

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I have used DAO P89's. 93's and 95's for over 15 years in my current agency. Out of all of them we had better luck with the P89's. The 93's were OK but the P95 DAO we had so much trouble with them most are shelved and they went back to the 89's and 93's or Beretta DAO's (which is also in inventory at some places) until a new firearm can be adopted.

The P89's ran and ran and ran. The only criticism was they feel a little top heavy but that could be fixed a little with a set of Hogue or Pachmayr grips.

Another vote for the p89...those guns are tanks that run and run, and run...

Well, I only own one Ruger P90 DC and it is a pretty fine unit. I would say that it at least as reliable as my Colt 1911's, XD 45's, Sig 229, Sig 239, Sig 2022, Glock 23/27/19 and so forth. They all work 100% of the time and are very easy to shoot well. Sure my Sig 229 appears to be a tad more refined but no more reliable or accurate than my Ruger P90. I would think that if the OP can find a nice P89DC or P90DC, he should be able to finish his career with a very reliable and safe duty weapon. Since the OP is familiar with the DA/SA, another option would be the very nice Sig 229 which can be had new or used without the rails. Sig has complete service for these and package deals to detail clean, replace springs and put on new night sights at a reasonable cost.