How much variation between different loads...

I am not a very accurate shot with the SA. So from someone who is, is there enough variation between midrange loadings with different powders, quality jacket bullets, and maybe bullet weights to worry about? Do I really need to bench rest different loads to eliminate that as a variable in my lousy groupings?

I shoot mostly a .41 Mag. I have loaded Tightgroup, Universal, HP38, Blue Dot until they said not to, Lil Gun, and Trail Boss with cast bullets. I get better groups it seems with the LilGun. Not what I was expecting.

Try AA#9, Unique, IMR 4227, 2400 with that .41 Mag. That's the powders I use. With excellent results. And Missouri Bullet Co. makes a coated, 215 gr Trooper that shoots great. Plus the Hornady XTP's

woodperson

is there enough variation between midrange loadings with different powders, quality jacket bullets, and maybe bullet weights to worry about? Do I really need to bench rest different loads to eliminate that as a variable in my lousy groupings?

Click to expand...

Not quite sure what you are asking, but differences in case, bullet brand, bullet weight, powder and gun can easily make a 1/2" or more difference in the group size at 25 yd when using a rest. So to answer yes you need to shoot from a rest when evaluating loads for accuracy. A good chronograph will help you see what's going on as differences in velocity produce differences in point of impact. If you are shooting mixed loads (differences between them) you will have random variation shot to shot. Without using a good rest or tripod I don't know if it's me or the load.

If you're doing accuracy testing w/o using some sort of support, all you're testing is your already confessed lack of accuracy.
Handguns can be accurate but this accuracy is far more dependent on shooter skill than long guns unless using a machine rest.

I applaud your honesty in admitting your skill level.

That said,, before you spend a lot of money on reloading components,, may I suggest you study a few manuals,, see what they recommend as far as the most consistent & accurate loads. Next, assemble just a few different ones.
Here is the important thing. Get someone else to shoot the gun & loads,, who is a good, accurate shooter. Establish a baseline of accuracy for the gun.
THEN,,,, do something many of us men, (thanks to a machismo gene,) have a hard time doing. Get PROPER instruction from a good instructor. Improve your skills before you work on what the gun likes.

I must be a lot like you. When I shoot revolvers I can not tell an accurate load from one that is not so accurate. Consequently I load handgun rounds to the velocity I want or prefer. ...BUT when shooting handgun rounds in a rifle, which I do a lot, I can tell an accurate load for sure. Most of my accurate rifle loads are near max loads of #9 or H-110 with XTP bullets.

If you want to check your accuracy with various loads shoot with your target set out at 50 or 75 yards.
You must shoot with support from a solid table and concentrate on each and every shot.
For rifle loads try 200 or even 300 yards.
At loger distance your groups will magnify so you'll see more difference.

Hi,

I seldom see this caveat in these discussions, but we should remember that accuracy testing with a six shot revolver is actually testing with six different guns! There are minute differences from chamber to chamber which may affect the absolute accuracy (the Ransom Rest approach) of the firearm. That's with the finest of revolvers, so to expect all six chambers to be anywhere close in a "slap it together, get it in the box and out the door" gun like Ruger provides in quantity is a pipe dream.

Six rounds, six targets... and use some kind of mark (like the "S" on the Ruger chambers) to ensure each target gets only shots fired from a particular chamber. You may be lucky and have six holes in the gun which will produce six holes on target in a very small group, or you may find one is "wild" or maybe all of them are a touch off. A lot of testing's in order! Have fun and learn things.

Rick C

Rick C is right. There is a difference in each chamber & it's alignment with the barrel to where each chamber is like an individual gun itself.

But,, I still say, as an instructor,,, I see a LOT of guys who do not have a proper grip, stance, trigger control, sight alignment, etc that makes their accuracy level different from those who have gotten proper instruction & all in those areas.
I still say you need to get an experienced, GOOD shooter to test your loads & gun before you worry about other things.
Distances shot can make things easier or worse. A close distance,, (3,5,7 yards) isn't the best way to determine much. I'd say that 7 yds is the closest a person should use as a test distance,, with the knowledge it will need to be increased when the skill level is there. I like to start testing a load in a gun at 25 yds. But,, I also know my skill level,, and feel it's the beginning point in checking ammo. I have seen many loads do fine up close,, but as distances get to 50, 100 yds or more,, bullet stability really comes into play.
A FINE shooter relayed it like this;
"No matter how good a gun is,, an unstable bullet will not be accurate at distances."

I'm near 70 and accuracy testing requires a scope. My eyes are the limiting factor on any test.

I have a scope on all my revolver "reference" guns for each caliber. 32, 38, 357mag, 357max, 44, 45 colt
A "reference" gun is one I know will shoot tiny groups consistently. It takes awhile to find and setup a gun for a "reference". At 25 yards, I expect .5" to 1" group size for a reference gun. At 100 yards, I expect 4" group size.
Even with this scheme, there is the occasional 1 out of 20 loads that shoots better in another gun than the reference.

I ONLY want to test my new recipe/loads.
I don't want to test me or the gun !

I religiously collect my data after every string.
I print out a spreadsheet for my different loads and capture relevant info immediately for later analysis.

I use a home-made bench, a Protektor rest, and shoot lots of 10 shot groups.

When I finish I know I have the best load (powder, powder weight, bullet config, bullet weight, and construction) for the reference gun. Then starts the testing of that best load in my other revolvers. If I get tiny little groups with the best load, I call it good, otherwise I try the second and third best.

It takes a lot to arrive at the best for each sixgun. I really love the process.


Prescut

There are lots of good powders that will cover a wide area of cartridges. You mention 41 magnum as what you shoot the most. I got a late start playing with the 41 magnum. Longshot is the powder I have come to like for midrange and upper midrange loads. It has been outstanding for speed and accuracy in my 41 magnums with bullets from 170-250 grain.

I was fortunate enough to go to The East Coast Gathering at Contender's place one year. He coached me for 15 minutes on grip and stance. The improvements were worth the drive. So what he's saying about other factors affecting accuracy are all true.

It as far as reloading, when I test a different powder for accuracy as compared to another powder, I use a regular handgun rest, not a ransom rest or anything fancy, but it steadies the gun enough I can see differences.

In this way, I do feel confident I can say some powders and some bullets are more accurate in one revolver to another.

For example, I like HS 6 in 38 Special over say 700x. This was my most recent comparison and just comes to mind. But I have found HS 6 to be fairly accurate in other calibers as well, like 357 and 327.

I just bought some Bullseye powder, but haven't used it yet. I love reloading because you can really get into trying different combinations.

PS, I'm just an average shooter myself as far as off hand accuracy is concerned by the way.

Do I really need to bench rest different loads to eliminate that as a variable in my lousy groupings?

Click to expand...

What's your experience level? And as alluded to above... At what distance? For example if you can't put them all in the ~same hole at 7 yards off hand, then you will get lousy groups at 25Y and beyond. No powder/bullet/primer combo is going to matter at this distance. Only practice is going to help. Load difference is going to start showing 15Y and beyond. In fact, I like to start at 15Y and then move to 25Y for a final check if the load interests me. Ie. "Gee, looks good on target and over the chrono, lets load some more up and try them at longer distance next time out".

Of course, if you are experienced, it might be the gun. Benching should tell you that.